No, because I don't want random, uncontrolled variations in EQ curves or left-right balance in my tracks. Why would I want inaccuracies in the correlation between a frequency on the knob and the actual frequency? I don't see how this would benefit my mix. It seems like a clever marketing gimmick, but its practical use is questionable.
However, I do appreciate the ability to dial in saturation across multiple tracks or groups simultaneously in their channel strips, so I’d keep that feature along with crosstalk. Everything else, in my opinion, unnecessarily complicates the mixing process.

 

Last edited: Sep 13, 2024

One thing though: the TMT thing can be turned off (say it's a bass track). However, when using such a channel strip, they're still being processed as stereo, right? I mean, I see two tracks on the TMT menu, even if I turn it off and choose the linked digital mode (L = R). In order to solve that, in Reaper, I can go pin connector > request VST3 mono. Is this solution correct? In any case, what really bugs me is: if I'm going to process e.g. a doubled LCR rhythm guitar (two separate DAW tracks), and the original signal is TMT stereo on each of the DAW tracks (i.e. without the pin connector adjustment and with TMT turned on)... when I hard pan each of the two tracks... what exactly is going on with the stereo image?

 

I completely agree regarding certain types of EQs lying to you about what frequencies are actually being altered (based on the frequency shown on the interface).

That's not my issue and I should have clarified. My issue is with the EQing being 1000Hz different on the Left versus Right channel. That seems like it can cause more issues than what it offers in benefits.

Obviously some of the sets of TMT channels are not even close to that much of a difference.

 

it's always a tradeoff in everything you do in mixing, in this case you gain stereo effect, you lose phantom center cohesion a bit.

Spoiler: what I think about it

it's a flaw, objectively comparing it to identical L/R processing as a benchmark is useless and.. kinda missing the point. IMO this is not things you analyze or trying to find the logic behind it, it's a simple thing that you listen, like it or not, move on. There is no serious problem with EQing different channel separately or all those TMT differences. All Neve (RND era) newer "stereo widening" function is using different EQing for L/R and MS method to create stereo widening effect. Obviously if you think objectively, analyze with science and all, it's not purely safe, it's always a tradeoff, you gain stereo effect, you lose phantom center cohesion a bit. Even a simple EQ move with 100% identical L/R, is some kind of tradeoff considering you move some part of frequency in the time domain (phase) if you think about it. Apart from it changes the perception of all the element in the sound, it will change the relation of one track to another.

 

Last edited: Sep 14, 2024

Not necessary, Reaper doesn't care. If you insert a stereo pluggie in a track with a mono source, it's still mono.

Two tracks would be an LR guitar, not LCR.

In terms of stereo image, 1 or 2 pins, TMT on or off doesn't matter, it's intact.

 

I gotta say, i still believe TMT can get really nasty.
In EQ the difference is a few hundred Hz and half db, add those variations with the dynamics section (which is audible in SLL strip): different ratios, different thresholds, different atk times, both for compressing and gating. What you end up is something really crazy, if that's not what you're going for.

 

Good to know, thanks! I meant like "LCR mixing style", with only 3 choices for the spectrum, but yes, one all the way to the left and opposite to the other.

 

I'm still trying to wrap my head around it and setting up a template to try an work with it! I'm mixing mostly 'vintage style', 'psychedelic' tracks, so I think these 'undesirable' consequences should be welcome! I wonder what the profiles for each TMT tracks are. Someone said that they had analysed each of them. I wonder if I should go with the random all button or make the template neatly organized track by track.

 

I did, and I have to say: or use TMT controlling every aspect or dont use it at all. As someone also wrote, it could be a mess for certain sounds to go with the random function. I never use the random function as the devolepr suggests in the manual. I just choose "randomly the channel I want"; it is different, it is like having anyway the control of what you are doing.

Do I have 3 stereo guitars? I choose 3 random channels among the "coupled channels" I have listed good for me for guitars: 9-10 11-12 or 13-14 15-16

 

Yes, i guess the way @patatern uses it must get better results than randomly selecting channels.

Like a Mixing Engineer in a real desk, after hearing it everyday for years, he would probably be aware of the discrepancies of each channel, and mix accordingly.

 

The deviation depends on the plugin. As you could see in my pics, the deviation is really minor. No one's able to recognize whether you change 38 or 43Hz, or, in case of several hundred, 12400 or 12600Hz.

 

Yes, i saw that deviation depends on the plugin in lemmys video. I guess it serves right because the deviation would also depend on the hardware (among other factors).
But i feel like we are talking about different plugins. I am talking about the SSL 9000J series Channel, which the deviations are not as minor as the API.

@MBC_Music showed a picture with a 1143Hz difference from L to R. and that's the EQ (you said earlier the dynamics section varations are less than audible in the API, i don't think that's the case with the SSL )

 

Ah, ok, yes, the difference between 3893 and 5036Hz is audible, no doubt (didn't know the hardware was so bad ).

 

I chose one of the worst pairs of channels (in terms of difference between L/R freq and dBs of gain) on the 9000J, but I can promise A LOT of the pairs of channels have extreme differences like this.

It would be good to use PluginDoctor to identify which pairs of channels you think are suitable for your specific applications, and then use those exclusively.

I don't even know about the differences in L/R compression.

 

It is the biggest bullshit on earth for dynamics!

Try this:

Open an ssl channel strip and set up the gate with TMT enabled. You will notice on headphones that the gate opens and closes differently on both sides.
this means, you will hear delayed vocal sounds for example, and most of the time soft sss or shhh or fffff sounds that travel from one ear to the other. It took a while to find out what was causing this ugly sound! It was the G channel wit TMT enabled. Turned it off - good.

which f****ing analog model does that kind of stuff?!

 

totally
as no avenger was saying, it seems like they did a better job with API's TMT

 

All of them! if you gate a stereo channel or 2 mono channels at the same time because it's different circuit for each. Analog, or console or even typical mixer workflow are centered around mono channels, from the microphone so gating and all are done in mono channel. Never saw even once in my lifetime people doing gating for stereo channel in analog.

EDIT : I didn't do test but judging from No Avenger findings about how there's no difference introduced by TMT in dynamic section, the gate triggering differently on each side must be caused by the difference of the peak level caused by the TMT flavoured EQing. The Channelstrip is dual mono with the TMT and linked stereo when TMT is off for the dynamic section I believe.

 

Last edited: Sep 18, 2024

its an interesting theory,
but the gate and compressor trigger differently for each channel even with the EQ section off

 

Last edited: Sep 18, 2024

don't know for sure but :

 

my bald guy is both German and Harkonnen...what could go wrong?