loseless flac files is all he stated. However, if the tracks in question are not good source files, the degradation of that frequency range would not be increasing the amplitude displayed. It would be lowered even further, not raised; if someone were to be applying 10Khz and up "cuts" to all these songs they are mixing. You are illustrating the point, not the other way around.

His question is, are they doing this on purpose? (or, will this "observation" work as clickbait on youtube?) How low was all of that range before they boosted the poor and degraded source files?

 

The drop off looks more dramatic than it is. All of 10kHz to 20kHz is crammed into the right most 7% of the GUI. If the X-scale were linear instead of log, the roll off would appear much more gradual and more in line with the rest of the spectrum - if the roll off then appears to be nearly perfectly linear, then it probably wasn't created by any deliberate filtering, because filters don't work linearly.

Yes, linear makes no sense for musical applications, but temporarily setting the scale to linear helps figure out the ground truth.

E: That being said - use a high shelf and use whatever sounds best to you.

 

I work in radio so I have access to the original files that the record companies send us and only then do we adapt them for broadcast. This rolloff is evident in the original files

Maybe I was wrong it would be more correct to refer to a gentle rolloff (12 or 24 db/oct) instead of cut at 10khz. I have tried it on about ten client tracks and as I said on headphones (airpods, earpods) and bluetooth speakers it all sounds less harsh and annoying

 

Thanks, I don't know you so I had to have doubts. The thread is very interesting but needed some scientific basis

I use on stereo buss the UAD Massive Passive EQ, and I sometimes use its HF 'rolloff' at 52k, that's a setting that many sound engineers use in mastering, I use it VERY rarely at 20-15k but on a bunch of tracks with a lofi vintage flavour

If an epic EQ like that [and others] have those filters it means that someone use em lol not only for vinyl laque cuts

But I don't 'mix in it', I just try that roll off with the last touches before exporting. That's my 2 cents

But honestly I don't think that we could use a rolloff at 10k on a modern pop track

Anyhow thanks, I will experiment

 

Last edited: Jul 10, 2024

Tried in SPAN with 4.5 slope, I used a relatively old track that clients often take for hip hop reference ("Travis Scott - Can't Say" if you want to take your analysis) and I can still see the rolloff, nothing over 20khz starting from around 10khz

 

Yeah, I said Airpods because they have an harsh boost, but the "top 100 songs" don't sound harsh. Mine mixes start to sound like these by doing a gentle rolloff 10/12 khz

 

This is were the battle between "audiophiles" and "sound eng" start.

1 will tell you those headphones have defined treble, firm bass ... whatever.
2 will tell them those cans are sounding "good" BECAUSE cans makers decided to boost/cut at some frequencies.
So they are NOT flat at all.

Same with "stereo image" : it is related to open (better stereo image)/closed design AND frequency boosted.
When you get more treble, your brain is tricked : better "stereo image" ... whereas it is not.
That's why 2 closed headphones can have a totally different "stage" image : more defined treble = better stereo image (to the brain only).

Stereo image on closed design means nothing (apart freq response) : 2 totally separate MONO drivers, with nothing "special" to link them.

Back to the subject :
Flat headphones are HORRIBLE sounding ... it is their purpose.
Like those "middle freq" speakers (auratone, NS10 ...).

An "audiophile" will never buy REAL flat headphones/speakers.
Sound eng are never going to mix on anything "audiophile"/pleasing.

PS : Cutting at 10 kHz is REALLY too low for me. I miss that subtle "air" definition. But it is not that obvious. I may not realize it without on/off. I may think i'm just tired :D

 

I've seem many ME on youtube use a PULTEC on the master bus to boost those high frequencies from 8k up

 

I tried with a steep cut but it's very obvious and sound "mp3", with a gentle rolloff everything start being clear

 

every pultec plugin has another curve different than the other and HW but maybe you meant HW anyways

is this whats called air or is it below ?

 

yes, true! and there's also other factors to consider like bandwidth... but i don't think those high frequencies are irrelevant!

yes you're right, this is called air.
not sure exactly where "air" starts though, could be a little lower, down to 6khz or something

 

bout 8k
Abbey Road Studios Brilliance Pack
sometimes does wonders sometimes not
the RS135 or RS127 Box ...rack unit not so much imho

 

"Air" is usually further up. That particular range is also where you will often see compression artifacts building up. 7-10K is often where I stick a non-vocal wide band de-esser. Like Fabfilter Pro-DS, Sonnox SuprEssor, or whatever one you like; to get rid of it. It's abrasive sound quality but from no obvious source. I like how they added these labels of each band in Claro, like Air and others, pic below. But if we wanted to chop all the "Air" from mixes like this, than why are Maag EQ-4 and Eiosis AirEQ known for what they do with this air band? Another way to show this rolloff is not done deliberately by the ME cutting anything. Or those plugins would be a very hard sell...