Received a contract yesterday for an Halloween release.

I like the original track but thought I could give it a more polished job especially in the high frequencies.

The original producer made some glitch movement to give that song some width but on my side, I find them harsh. Still, it does give the original version some energy and grit that I think can be desirable.

My idea was quite simple, just redo something in the genre but with a more authentic (or old) reggaeton vibe.

Now that I'm done with the rough idea and mix, I find it lack soul and ''surprise'' factor. I mean, it's still urban pop music so I'm definitely not trying to reinvent the wheel here but still.....

I'm used to over do parts and then sent back to the bench to make it more ''listener friendly'' and I'm just trying to figure if that's just too linear (which I believe) or if I should just send it as is and call it a day.

Original :
https://vocaroo.com/1nR2K9eeyLok


Remix :
https://vocaroo.com/146r9RIgSe7j

 

Your version is defo better than the original, IMHO.

 

It lacks low end, kidding ;)

Your version defo sounds balanced and more enjoyable, honestly tho that hi hat/snare sizzle @ 1:45 in the Original version is kinda nice, too loud yes but...would play well on phones ??

 

I too think it sounds just fine. I wouldn't mess more with it so just send it and consider it done

 

I also have the same point of view. Also, his low end is more complex.

His master is U-scooped, mine in comparison is mid forward. I like the ''complexity'' of his instrumental and the sound design that he put on top ( even though it sound harsh).

Thanks for the comments guys, appreciated.

 

I'd pick the remix anyday over the original, the low end of the original is all messed up which i think is what's making it sound wider and bouncier but it also makes it sound amateurish af.

The only thing i missed in the remix is more panning of "dry" elements, sounds like most of the time everything is in the center aside from the reverb and other atmospheric things while the original has a hihat thingy, synth, stereo kick (wtf?) and whatever, that might be part of why you feel it lacks "surprise". But at the same time, the lack of all that makes the atmospheric elements shine a lot more, i'd call that a win.

Also lookie here, a mix that actually has mids, who would know such thing was possible? Congrats.

 

It's a very conservative composition and mix that I have created in comparison.

It's not the first time that I hear modern urban production panning their low end very wide. It also seems to be more and more popular but sometimes it's over done and it sound strange.

It's always a risk to go on that path but as modern pop music production is very redundant, it also brings a challenge to all of it and develop different ideas. I wouldn't necessarily say better ideas but the experience can be interesting sometime.

I don't know how familiar you are with pop music but there's a wide range of ideas that came to fruition and some of them were questionable on a technical perspective but they did work great with the crowds.

For example, this original song glitch, noises and haas effect on the hi hats could have been brilliant if it was properly mixed and had not been harsh and killed the rest of the highs with the lack of inteligibility.

I think I'll try to lower the overall front value of the drums (or scrap the top line all together) and work something out to give it more movement.

 

Gonna be a very long reply OP but I hope there’s stuff you can take away from my analysis.

As with all opinions online, take mine with a grain of salt. But I am a producer and have a ton of experience with arrangement. Anyway, here are my thoughts:

I don’t dwell much in this genre and I sure as hell don’t understand Spanish. So I am approaching this purely from an arrangement standpoint and taking into account the “listener-friendliness” aka Poppy/Urbaness structure of the track. Tried my best to label the sections but just take them as placeholder names just so I could label them.

I’m here to assure you that the feeling of lack of soul and “surprise” factor is valid. I understand that there is a certain character you notice about the original mix and though it isn't perfect, it shines through. This is why mixing and producing is such an interesting dance between doing enough without losing the magic. His arrangement is constantly shifting sonically, keeping it exciting. The arrangement of the original is clearly repetitive yet dynamic enough that it doesn’t sonically feel like the sections are just, repeating. The textures and how they take up space are neat and drive home the rhythm (something your remix is lacking but is your artistic choice)—the original track is pretty well-produced. Refer to Figure 1 for just how expansive the sections are. His choices for the mix are definitely on the harsh side but it adds to the grit and IMO leaning towards the U-shape is just part of the modern sound. However, the original mix could be done better and it's just too harsh at parts. This is why I just focus on producing so I don't end up losing the magic and let a third-party mix engineer (final mix) make my vision sit together.

Figure 1:


For comparison, your arrangement (Refer to Figure 2) is not changing much and it gets too repetitive. Compared to how I’ve labeled the original, you can tell there’s less going on. From an arrangement standpoint, you need to create a push and pull because you don’t want the energy to remain the same

Figure 2:


A nice arrangement idea would be combining both ideas the original and remix versions do well and make it into one (Refer to mp3 file “Arrangement Comped”) to balance the energy throughout the track. I like that your version opens with a more defined chorus/opening idea (which the Original mix lacked, it had no "hook") and just gets the groove started. It’s roughly spliced together just to help get the idea of the flow of things. It’s not changing as much as the original but at least the sections are not too repetitive (Refer to Figure 3). If there’s still time and energy you’re willing to put in I’d go back to make some edits to match the excitement factor you’re trying to achieve. I get it, it’s pretty tough to produce and mix at the same time but you’re already on the right track. Though it’s mid-range focused, I do prefer how the Original vocals were sitting cuz the mids do sound a bit cluttered to me at the moment. The original has that scoop more present in modern tracks. But again, this is a matter of taste and I'm not implying your mix is in any way mudded up.

Figure 3:


Also, your bassline notes would sound tighter going the C# - F# - G# progression instead of starting on that G# fifth. The main melodic elements I hear are also going in the progression I mentioned and if the bass line is gonna start on the fifth it’s gonna lack that root especially on your chorus idea (no pun intended) unless that was intentional. You can try the root and see whether you prefer it.

With all that said I wouldn’t worry too much about it either. It's fine, but you and I know it could be better. If I sounded rude or too critical in this reply don't take it personally, I'm much, much harsher on myself lol. I think the track sounds great and I just hope the potential is reached. It's always an endless pursuit of perfection and it's up to you to decide when to let it go

 

Last edited by a moderator: Sep 12, 2023

No !!! You did not sound rude at all. I REALLY appreciate you taking the time.

You seem to have a more structural approach to arrangement than I do but I believe we are hearing the same thing and the Figure 1 vs Figure 2 analysis that you did is also exactly how I hear it.

I did not understand your idea of the figure 3 or the preceding paragraph but what I know is that you convinced me that I really need to go back to the board and listen to my instinct.

The structure is solidly built but I need to put some fancy on it. It is seriously lacking THAT thing. Sometime I just go a bit crazy and I don't want to deceive him as he's a reference from a good friend. Plus I actually like the original artist/singer style even though I never talked to him.

I also think that my vocals are getting buried a bit in the mid lows (600-700hz ?) but i do prefer how they sit compared to how harsh and just plainly noisy on some bits on the original. Yet, if I'm honest, it's most probably because mine is a lot more simple.

One thing for sure, I don't want to force change my taste to fit the U shape commercial mix type. I appreciate the opportunity but also value my personality and artistic approach in it.

I'll go make this sound more...JUNGLE !!! Yeah !

Thanks a lot for taking the time.

 

Figure 3 would be what the mp3 file on my first reply covers. It's the Original and your Remix spliced together, to represent the flow of energy structure-wise. My analysis just seems really structured but usually in my own arrangements, I don't go to the extent of labeling so much haha. I just wanted to help get my point across effectively. You don't have to make as many changes as the original mix in Figure 1 was what I was suggesting, just enough to not let things go stale.

And yeah! You don't have to go for the commercial mix type, but the vocals are slightly buried. But it's too early for me to judge since it's still rough, I'll leave the mix notes to the other mixers on here lol.

For the preceding paragraph, I attached a mp3 demo just playing within the progression I suggested. You can still add your walking bass line idea but it was just a suggestion for bar 1 of every 2-bar cycle to start on the root as the chordal (synth) information underneath it is going C# - F# - G#. Starting on the G# is fine too but it's a general rule of thumb that if you really want to drive the rhythm home you want the bass to follow the drums and define the root clearly, especially for this type of genre. That's how rhythms stay tight. Again, this is just a suggestion :D

 

Last edited by a moderator: Sep 12, 2023

And I do appreciate your suggestion. Really.

Let me try that. I'll report later on after I'm done with something decent percussion wise.

 

So I decided to take a more electro minimalist approach (after an horrible failure early in the morning at trying to play the folley game like the original) but I finally decided to go a bit over the board on the low end to bring some energy back in the mix and give it a bit of edge in the highs of the vocals (2.5khz or about).

I'm so much into it that I pretty much lost perspective at this point.

Input would be more then welcome. My ears are pretty much done for the day.

https://voca.ro/1bfZRJkovQMj


I have doubts on the gain levels of the corny risers, impact and downers but also in the highs.

The rest seems to sit tight. No more vox conflict in the mid lows as far as I can tell.

 

I would have loved the kick to stop the drums @ 0:38 then hit it with the heavier drum pattern @ from 0:46. what you had there in relation to the vocals really fucked up my groove

maybe slap on the Ableton metronome from 0:41 then stop it when your drum role comes in and then do your BOOM. nice and ratchet

take my words with a punch of salt, after all, I am a failed producer

 

I'm sorry, I think I must be as drunk as you are at this point.

What's an Ableton metronome ? I never used Ableton in my entire life so I don't know what you are referring to.

Are you talking about my DAW metronome or the Hi Hat hitting every 1/8ths ?

 

it's daw metronome

seriously though the groove from 0:38 to 0:46 doesn't work. drop the drums because it starts dragging with the vocal, bring the heavier pattern from 0:46. maybe even chop the kayanda part or something

 

There's no metronome sound in the whole song.

Whats a Kayanda part?

I'm sorry, I have a hard time understanding your ideas.

 

forget the metronome

from 0:40 it clearly says kayanda and im saying you should drop the drums from 0:38 then bring it back @ 0:46 because they sound weak and interrupt the groove. leave the drum roll or fill or whatever then hit it back 0:46

 

Caliente ? hahahaha

All right, I'll try just that. Thanks mate. I appreciate the input.

 

I hope it helps and one thing when you stop the drums from 0:38 stop it at the kick that's at the beginning of the next bar. that's what my body wanted. I know it sounds crazy but small changes look this can lead to clarity, wider perception

 

I"m sure it will. I agree with you. Small things make a big change in perception.