I don't use daws since a quite long time, and I just cleaned off a bit of rust from Live.

I face this situation:
I want to import an audio file (no problem here), and because it's far from a perfect tempo it shifts phase continuosly in a random fashion - faster, then slower, then faster and so on -

Now, I want to "discover" its average bpm tempo within Live daw without the help of external sw, with the Tap function.

If I import any audio the default option wil enable warp, still, the default tempo won't change (120).
So I disable warp feature to get rid of all warp markers, play the file and begin to tap tempo, to at least get a rough one.

Now the issue: it begins a ridiculous loop between my tapped tempo and the speed of the played file, making impossible to get a proper bpm tempo (like, say, Traktor instead does).

I hope I was clear about the issue, I read a lot of forums about this, and it seems that the only thing to do is to load it in session view, disable warp and tap, and it worked once, but when I tried again it didn't work, maybe because there was the same track in arrangement view too.
Why on earth should I load it in session, do the whole thing, and then move it in arrangement and delete the session view that I don't need?
I mean, is it a bug or what?

Second: I hope to be wrong, but it seems that I cannot insert warp markers on the fly while the track is playing via shortcut or else, that would be wonderful once finished in order to realign the track to the original average tempo (let's say 125) moving the warp markers to the downbeat of the measures.
Do I miss something?

I'm sure I did this it in Reaper, stretch markers on the fly first and then snap to the grid, pretty fast.

 

If the tempo keeps changing & the warp doesn't work! i find it better chopping up & rearranging. As for tapping there's a few online
http://www.all8.com/tools/bpm.htm
https://tunebat.com/Analyzer

 

I know there are many external sw offline and online to solve the issue, just, I want to solve this question within Live because another guy asked me that and he uses Live only and is not much skilled on PC.
However I fear that it's not easy as wished with this daw.

 

Tempo control

Tap Tempo and Nudge Left/Right buttons are essential for live performance, helping you to stay in sync with turntables, other musicians or a live band, and correct timing issues quickly.

Tap tempo
As you hit the Tap Tempo button once every beat, the tempo of the Live Set will follow your tapping.
You can also use tapping to count in: If you are working in a 4:4 signature, it takes four taps to start song playback at the tapped tempo.

Nudge
On stage and in the studio, you may find yourself in situations in which you need to adjust to sources that aren't locked to one tempo, such as live musicians or turntables. You can use the Nudge buttons to temporarily speed up or slow down Live's playback to match what you hear.

Source: www.ableton.com/en/products/controllers/apc40mkii/tempo-control/

 

That's not going to help when the music within the loop is played incorrectly. You need something like Logic Flex Time to actually move all the transients around. It is still "offline" processing. Nothing is going to fix badly played material/off-tempo material within a loop in realtime, because it is wrong.

 

@orbitbooster, sadly I don't have a solution for you. But since it seems no one really reads the original post, just a confirmation..

Yes, you are right. And the solution you gave is the only one inside Ableton that I know of (or playing the music with an external source). I'll see, if I can find something else that may be of help. Just so you know - your Q is very concise.

 

No, I do not pretend a one click solution in automated fashion, nor a realtime machinery, actually, I've always done this kind of stuff manually, once I aligned a classical piece to a clip with "microstretches" and it was a tedious work, but in Reaper was faster and easier than in Ableton as I can see now with simpler rhythmic pieces.

I must admit that Ableton is not made for that purpose, so, creating a master audio track with unsteady bpm to carve tempo and build tracks/layers on that is not its primary role though I still think that in the (offline) arrangement view there should be such an option, because live session view allows that, and is a mistery.

Fixing badly sync'ed traks is possible with daws, but some are more flexible than others.
At least in this, Reaper is more friendly than Ableton (but you have to change project settings), and I'll try to explain why, maybe making a small clip about fixing tracks comparing the two daws.

 

If all else fails then play to that groove as it fluctuates in time and later nudge the notes you just midi recorded if they don't stay in the pocket.

Play that funky music white boy,
Play that funky music white...
Play that funky music white boy
Lay down and boogie
And play that funky music till you die.

 

Wow - now I'm into something, I ignored the Lead-Follow stuff, not yet completely clear to me the workflow but gears begin to move as intended, experimenting in the meanwhile

 

@JMOUTTON, great tips there

Ypp, I used this with OK results. Open an unwarped clip with varying tempo and adjust tempo automation on master so that transients align and metronome clicks right. Then you have the option to either keep the tempo automation or warp the clip (the result will usually be 'almost' perfect with the right warp mode), delete the master tempo nodes and it will play in sync with the set tempo.

Very interesting.. edit: oh yes, the Warp Follow. I've done this too, totally forgot..;)

 

Last edited: Dec 20, 2022

I got something, but still there is something I miss in the workflow, because once it works and the other not, like it was random process.
I know tempo automation is involved, but I cannot yet consolidate the workflow, eperiments ongoing.
I guess in anyway this is the best answer.

 

Yhea, Live is fiddly with things like that. I am not a user, I dabble with on other people's machines when working with others. The easiest way I know of creating a solid tempo map for live is create one in PT / DP / Logic / Cubase and loop a closed HH on all quarter notes for the duration of the song, export that as Audio and use it to create a live groove.

I didn't mention it because it requires creating an actual beat map in an other DAW.

 

I confirm this: though I managed to do it someway in arrangement (I don't know how the fck I did) I couldn't replicate the workflow, so remains the official - by the book - procedure JUST in session view: