I know what a D-esser does and I know how to use it.
But there is too much brightness in the whole mix in general, in the second version, not in the first.
This means (according to my ear) that you put too much brightness on it. therefore, it is not resolved by putting a de esser. It is solved by adjusting the frequencies.

It's like you put a compressor and you go over compression and to remove the compression I tell you “ha, yes, go ahead and put an expander”. It wouldn't make much sense, would it?
because the ideal thing would be to go back to the compressor and remove the overcompression.

Now, you can brighten the whole mix and then treat the extra shine with plugins, like desser, multbands, etc. But the sound (as I said before) will be less natural and more artificial due to excessive use of plugins.

Edit:
That's why I said that from my point of view, he needs to get a hold of him.
Well, it's a mix, at first I thought he created the music.
But if he has the tracks, he can work on it more, and you'll get a smooth tone.
The hidden voice can be solved in several ways
With UnMask, equalization (fine) maybe the Unfilter plugin can help you, both on vocals and in the mix, but subtly.

 

I'd throw a low cut on the vocal, maybe add some fresh air from slate digital and some subtle saturation and call it a day lol

Edit: on the first mix that is.

 

Last edited: Jul 9, 2022

I tried to "clean" and define your first mix. Vocals seem more present and clean to me.

https://voca.ro/14WQh4AvMS2Q

What do you think?

 

i think only way to fix problem is going down to vocal and do some high pass. everything else seems ok besides the vocal and maybe a bass

 

You are right, you need to solve it in the mixing stage. I just don't know if some high pass will be enough to solve it.

 

This sounds much, much better.

Edit:

Here you can hear much better the defined voice, the present bass, the sax, etc.
It has a little more shine than my personal taste.

But yes, taking the mix could be achieved much better. That drum sounds kind of weird, so it should be brought into the mix.
But if only the mixt existed, this version would be very good

 

It was kind of an experience/challenge for me, trying to improve an already "finished" mix/song. In the last few years I've been struggling and trying to create better mixes, more balanced, with more clarity and definition, and also as loud as most top charting songs. I understand TheMoss struggle and the long and difficult course he has in front of him.

 

I have been mixing my songs for more than ten years, also on some occasions I help mix friends and acquaintances. But I'm always experimenting with the mix. And it's not easy to find a balance. Also today with the banners and sound warfare, it can confuse you a lot and get you out of the way. Something that works quite well for me. It is, mix, leave that mix for a while, and make another song, after a while open the mix again and there you hear all the details that you didn't hear before.
I still don't think there is a "Standard" for mixing and EQing, at least not from an artistic point of view. I mean, there is Auto Mastering, Auto eq, etc. But these things can help you like destroying a whole song. It is a matter of time and patience.

 

smooth song -- takes me back to the 70's. version 1 is the vibe i think. i like the scooped MOR radio sound, it suits the song. version 2 is too aggressive, and bordering on harsh.

seeing it is a thing, i did some eq'ing on version 1. maybe, "a sound will paint a thousand words". i tried to stay to the 'spirit' of your mix, just made some space for it to breath:

https://voca.ro/1gkgO2XvJnQ9

it is only a very rough idea, there is only a certain amount you can do with a 2track file, but i think it addresses some of the problems with the mix. there is a lot of boxy mid range build up. i think that is why you are making the drums too loud and having trouble with sitting the vocals and other elements 'in' the mix - you need to make space for them. notice you can still hear the drums although they are much quieter, and they are not messing with anything else or creating too much top end fluff. they fit the mood of the song better, but that is only my opinion.

if you leave some space you will not have to turn things up or have things masked by boxy, cruddy build up. you can still get a smooth scooped sound with plenty of that big bass, but will not have to have too many frequencies build up -- because sounds will not have to fight each other for space. sounds will sit within the spectrum rather than on top of the mud. you will get more depth as well.

 

I don't mean to be rude but the equalization you did, at least to my ears, doesn´t seem to bring great improvements to the original mix. TheMoss original mix is balanced and quite aceptable, with the most significant issue beeing the fact that the vocal was muffled and needing to be brought to the front of the mix. But this is just my opinion, maybe other people can listen to both versions and have a different opinion.

 

the voice is still hidden, muffled, masked

 

did you read what i wrote? it was just to illustrate a specific point, not do a better mix or a remix, it is TheMoss's mix.

if you can not hear all the build up at around 800 and how it is affecting stuff, then i do not know what to tell you.

i like the vibe of the mix, but there are problems with it. TheMoss has expressed interest in being a professional in the past. i would not sign off if i was paying for it, maybe you would.

once again, "it is only a very rough idea, there is only a certain amount you can do with a 2track file"

you have to read. i was trying to make a specific point, not do a better mix or a remix, it is TheMoss's mix.

 

did you read what i wrote too?

I am giving my point of view.

It is assumed that if you upload something here in the forum, it is for any member to comment, if you do not like the opinion of others, send the mix privately.

 

Nice Steely Dan sort of song. And some really sweet Rhodes playing. That's what I was listening to. Unless this is for commercial release, I wouldn't be sweating the details. I'd be happy I'd written a cool song. But yeah, if it needs to be radio ready, more bass and clearer vocals. And if I was producing, I'd try some percussion. Congas, bongos. Smooth and sexy.

 

i do not see why you have to get so angry about it. i was just pointing out that you clearly misunderstood the point of the exercise. just trying to be helpful, nothing more.

comment all you want. give all the opinions you want -- even if they are misguided. it was not for you anyway, it was for TheMoss. it was their mix, not mine. i did not do a mix -- just illustrating a point, if anyone else finds it interesting then all the better. i will do what i want, but thanks for the unnecessary advice.

 

I don't think voice is overly muffled but could have a little more highs sheen.
The mix has a good balance overall but I don't like very much the drum mixing. I'd place the hi-hat more centered than that, and also the tom fills a little more narrow.
I don't like the the kick eq, it sounds, to me, a little bit too sharp and weak at the same time, I'd prefer a more rounder and fuller sound and with that sound I'd probably cut 1/1.5 dbs in volume.
Snare drum is ok overall but I'd cut 1/2 db of volume and I'd prefer a little softer attack and I'd add a little top end saturation (hi hat too). Bass guitar would sit better with these changes IMO and wouldn't need any adjustment except maybe 1/1.5 db increase in volume.
I'd take out the flanger on the master.
I'd do a gentle pass with tape (Studer 80) on the master too.
That said well played and arranged and very good vocals.
Just my 2 cents

 

No, I'm not angry at all.
I was just telling you that I was giving my point of view and that maybe it had bothered you, because you put, did you read what I wrote?
So I said, maybe he doesn't like being told something.
It's just that there are people who get upset when they ask for an opinion and one gives it. I understand that when it comes to a material that one does with all the love, and receives criticism that perhaps one does not expect, it can be "annoying" that's why I told you "it's my point of view"
but never get mad, we are just exchanging points of view

 

Edit

I confused the inbox with the forum. I'm sorry, I wanted to delete but I can't. Sorry

 

i do not mind being told something if it is relevant to what i was trying to do.

i was not asking for an opinion. i was just illustrating a point to TheMoss with an example. if you had read what i wrote you would not have misunderstood that.

it is pretty obvious that it was your 'point of view' -- what else would it be? i do not need to be told that -- just like i do not need to be told something about a "voice" when when i was not trying to do anything about a "voice".

i am not just exchanging my 'point of view': you do not know what i was trying to do; i know for a fact what i was trying to do. i am telling you the facts of the matter.

 

From the moment you put anything in a public forum, anyone can express an opinion even if you don't ask for it. If you don't want opinions, go to the private.

If I read what you wrote, the point is that you want to put something on a forum and it seems that if someone says something to you, you get upset.


And to be honest, everything you say is based on the same thing. At first I thought I had misunderstood you. But it's obvious that it bothers you when someone says something you don't want to hear. Do you know what I do when I'm not interested in an opinion? I'm still long