For Apple and Logic Pro users like myself, the subject of this topic was something worth discussing. As far as I'm concerned it raises issues of whether this community is capable of conducting a civil forum where simple courtesies and respectfullness are expressed without it descending into crude and juvenile insults.

 

here's a decent explanatory video on the CPU technology, for fellow not-so-hardocre-techy folks I recommend watching this to get a brief idea on why ARM can easily destroy Intel/AMD in every way possible:

 

Thank you for getting the topic back on track. And thank you for reminding me why I don't even try understanding computers. Same reason I take my car to a mechanic.

 

PC vs Mac war is useless and so tiring about time. Do you really think musicians care? As a working musician I don't give a damn. It sounds childish to me really. Some people here should grow up a little bit and should play music instead of complaining about this or that. Back in 80's, we didn't have much and nowadays people are so spoiled they are just able to complain about everything.

 

This was encouraging as far as avoiding the previous issues of Apple's switch from Power PC. It seems if cross-compatibility can truly be easier accomplished in ARM the software stuff might have a higher survival rate. I don't think ARM's capabilities were ever in doubt though.

 

Well this is great news. If Intel is abandoned by one of it's valuable customers , it will be pushed to innovate more and maybe drop some prices if it still wants to be competitive against AMD in the PC race. Also LPX users may have greater advantage , as it will be built to run natively on ARM. Just like FCPX and metal. The only downside I see is the opportunity to build a hakintosh after 2-3 years, as intel based Macs will be obsolete and so the apps that can run on it. But it will be fun to see all this brains from cracking teams figuring out new ways to crack ARM based LPX etc

 

I agree completely. This mac vs PC crap has destroyed the chance for us to talk about what may be the biggest news for music producers outside of the PC world in decades. As you say, grow up. Sounds like a bunch of kids in a pissing contest.

 

Yep, the Fugaku, is the strongest cluster in the world atm with Fujitsu built ARM cpus and with over twice the power of the second which is IBM. And actually Fujitsu is keen on upgrading their ARM cpu hehe.
If i can be the devil's advocate on this, AMD wants to change things, i expect they will drive an even more aggressive policy on their server cpus in terms of pricing, to battle both ARM and Intel and gain more ground in the super computer/cluster territory. They have the tech and in terms of performance-per-watt they have already beaten Intel and they are very close to ARM. Perhaps AMD's Zen 3 will paint a more clear picture about the future -if any- of x86 cpus. We 'll see won't we
Cheers mate

 

Yeah, just like Mojave and High Sierra are obsolete now and you can run no software on them.

 

DAC means Digital Audio Converter so it has no relation to the audio processor they're mentioning.

 

RISC vs CISC architecture
https://www.microcontrollertips.com/risc-vs-cisc-architectures-one-better/

 

It doesn't seem like there is a clear advantage of one over the other. Can we just make them battle and see who wins?

 

@Olymoon This is not political (almost on the line I'd say), please don't delete this thread !

 

The thread in itself is not political at all
Apple moves to self produced ARM cpus for the Mac - Bye Bye Intel

It's a technical and consumer conversation expressed.

Some members made political comments which have been cleared.

So please guys, keep this thread in topic, this is not a political thread, nor another useless PC vs Mac thread.

 

Last edited: Jun 26, 2020

@Olymoon Sorry if i brought you trouble with my comment chief, i promise to be more careful when i express my views

 

CISC has won too many times in the recent years in the desktop/laptop and workstation environments. One of the reasons why Intel and AMD make billions and are top 50 Fortune 500 companies. But let's not forget Apple is number 4 with a bullet in the same chart and number 1 tech company worth 1 fkn trillion dlrs and it would be unwise for anyone to think they got there by sheer luck or without knowing their left from right. Their move is calculated, we 'll just see if it pans out in all parts of the comp market.
So to speak plainly, CISC relies much more on the hardware coded instructions and RISC relies much more on software. Both Intel and AMD have tremendously good hardware and can endure badly written code which -unfortunately- is the majority of Windows applications (and MacOS has its share on this too but less because its Unix based and easier to code). This makes Intel & AMD cpus quite robust in terms of software execution and although we may constantly run buggy softies, these cpus excel in performance and we learned to forgive unwanted system or individual glitches due to the sheer power of modern CISC systems. RISC is much more easy to program apps for, but imho, as we have seen time and time again, it is always the software that lacks behind the hardware and not the other way around. Moore's law has been surpassed many times in the recent years but the damn software has always bugs. Always. Therefore, RISC is still prone to failure vs CISC because in the end of the day, the front end of comps and what most people interact with, is the software they run. And with CISC it makes little difference if the soft if fully robust or a bit buggy. With RISC it makes all the difference in the world and can bring a comp to its knees if the soft running is "misbehaving". This is why ARM architecture has found its calling in clusters and supercomputers where it runs under a fully controlled environment and all apps are completely debugged bringing out the best the ARM cpus can offer.
Thanks for listening

 

Last edited: Jun 26, 2020

My whole thoughts condensed in one line. We want that battle and we want it now!!

Give it time

I was going to go technical but I don't have the heart today. I stick with playful bad jokes...

 

Last edited: Jun 26, 2020

In case you dont know, it's also possible to remain silent when we have nothing to bring to a conversation.

 

You didn't begun that political thing, but please refrain to answer off topic comments.

 

One thing we didn't talk about but sort of slipped through is the new Mac cpus, just like the I-Pad cpus, will have integrated graphics made by Apple. I already hear many pros in the video and 2D/3D industry are extremely troubled about what will happen with graphics compatibility. Will all their high end GPUs and dedicated accelerator cards that cost multi-thousands of dlrs stop working ? The premise isn't clear yet and this will surely play a significant role in Apple's next phase success. And to speak the truth the video/film/2D/3D industries is where Apple has the strongest following compared to other pro content creation categories.
On the other hand Apple has already a Mac Mini with Arm ready for software devs, which says Apple means business alright:

Of course it's yet to be determined if Apple's move can outperform or at least be on par with Intel's cpus. The race has begun and we 'll see who wins what.
Cheers