Last night I had an epiphany about a specific type of Plugin Reviews/Tests you find a lot of on YouTube these days: direct A/B Comparisons of 2 or more analog modeled plugins of certain hardware units. Like your 1176's, your SSL's, API's, you name it. (TLDR? Just skip to Point 4!)

The Situation: I was playing a little game called 2048 on my 10 Inch Lenovo YogaTab Tablet whilst listening to Plugin A/B Plugin comparisons on YouTube. Somebody was comparing the emulation of Neve 1073 PreAmps from UAD, Slave, Waves and Arturia. Another video was comparing the new Arturia Compressors against plugins by other well-established brands.

Since I was playing the game, I only could hear the audio coming out the speakers of this little tablet, which, btw, has incredibly good sounding speakers for being a tablet. So the listening situation was that of the average every day listener: a sub-optimal listening environment and a less conscious level of attention to acoustic details of the audio signal due to being pre-occupied by another task.

I listened to the sound of the comparisons more or less unconsciously because my atention was focused on the game primarily. But whenever the audio playback skipped due to latency issues by changing the plugins in the chain, it draw my attention to listening again.

What I could hear was: changes in Threshhold, changes in Attack and Release times, the amount of compression and of course, changes in the the color of the harmonic distortion introduced by driving the plugins' inputs. What I could not hear was: a mind-boggling difference between any of them. They all did a similar thing: compress, saturate or distort the signal, in this case: Drums. (But I noticed one plugin breaking up really, really badly when driven too hard. I found out later that it was the UAD 1073 PreAmp. I own a UAD Card so it's not a pun, I just noticed that while listening).

At this point I was really asking myself these more or less profound questions:

1. If I, a trained sound designer, can often only hear minute differences between plugins with matched settings on a single sound source on monitor speakers, better yet a tablet, how many listeners out there listening on shitty ear buds or phone speakers can actually tell, if I used the UAD or the Waves Plugin?

Answer: None. Nobody cares about the plugins. As Andrew Scheps puts it: "What matters is what comes out of those (points at speakers), not how you got there".

2. What difference does it make for listeners who a) never hear elements of the song in solo, b) are pre-occupied by something else while listening to music anyway?

Answer: None. Because the focus of the listener is the feel of the Song, in other words: the macro structure of the music, not the 40k Air Band of the MAAG EQ! So the validity of an A/B Comparison of various 1176 Compressors on Drums is insignificantly small when put in context to the rest of a mix!

3. If all of the above is true, why the hell some of us are so obsessed with trying to get not just any plugin emulation of a thing that has a certain sound (that most of us never used/heard in real life anyway) but THE BEST of the best?

Answer: t's a multi-facetted answer, including psychological as well as systemic aspects of how modern capitalistc economic society and social media works.

Psychological Aspects: in general, we humans are always curious to what's new in any field of personal interest. In german, we call it "Neu•Gier"; which translates into something like beeing greedy for everything of "newness". So we are always into the seemingly newest, hottest shit, although there's really nothing new when it comes to mixing effects – it's still Dynamics, EQ and Delay/Reverb for the most part. In other words: manipulation of Amplitude, Frequency and the time domain! You see my point, right? If we weren't so obsessed with having all these plugin emulations of analog gear, the plugin market would be like 75 % smaller with only solely clean digital EQs and Compressors available…

The second aspect is more individual: hording plugins is the result of over-compensating a lack of experience in or talent for production which consequently creates a longing for having that new plugin which is "the shit". A lot of people feel like, "I really, really need this 1176 from xyz to be able to reach the next level" although thay may have 6 different 1176 Plugins already and probably never had the luxury of referencing the physical hardware – I know I haven't. Rationally, it doesn't make any sense to have more than 2 Plugins of any hardware model, but somehow we all manage to trick ourselves into buying yet another PulTec or SSL Channel Plugin, because we think it improves our music sooo much when it doesn't. Trust me, I've been there, too!

Aspects of economics: this state of "self-consciousness" as described above is the number one "loophole" every commercial plugin manufacturer taps into and injects their maketing into the mind of aspiring musicians and producers who feel helpless: they evoke in you the feeling that with their plugins you become a better musician or producer.

The business of these companies is not you becomming a better musician or producer! In reality, theses companies are just another cog in the wheel of a capitalist economic society. Meaning, the need to create and sell "new" products to you to be able to sustain a living. That's just the "nature" of society we live in. So on one hand you have this seemingly infinite cycle of supply and demand but on the other end you have this finite amount of possible products (again: Dynamics, EQ, Delay/Reverb). So manufacturers have to not only convince people that something is new, they have to also create the demand for their products.

The Influence of Social Media Marketing: EMail, YouTube, Influencers, Facebook/Instagram – whenever I have a look at my Instagram timeline, I get specific adds tailored towards my interests for digital audio stuff. My mailbox is bombarded every day with plugin discounts for "new products".

On YouTube, we have dozens of production-, mixing- and plugin-related channels who do plugin tests and so-called "reviews". I don't want to discredit any of them, some of them are actually really great and hosted by experienced music producers or engineers whos primary source of income is their work in the field of audio and not revenue from creating content for YouTube. For example, I love Reid Stefan's Channel (aka realest Puppet in the Game). They do the work for me, so I don't have to do it myself: objectively comparing plugins, which is a tideous and boring process, tbh.

But it's becoming a problem, whenever creators have to rely on YouTube as their primary source of income which urges them to produce content on a weekly, sometimes daily basis to sustain a living. And every time a new plugin hits the market, you see a review on every freaking audio related youtube channel ever, praising it and trying to shove it down your throat by attaching discounts to it via affiliate programs and so on. And then, in a moment of irritation, excitement, weakness and hope of overcomming ones mediocrity you buy the thing. And a month later you already forgot that you own it.

4. The remedy: we all know the excitement of having the latest greatest plugins at our disposal for a moment and then it all fades away quickly because buying plugins is really easy compared to actually spending thousands and thousands of hours on production until you know what you are doing. So here's my guide to buying analog modeled plugins specifically:

• Don't buy any plugin based on the rationale that it will turn you into a better musician/producer!!!
• Ask yourself: do I have one of these models already? (Don't buy more than 2 or 3 of everything at max, you won't use them anyway)
• Don't think using plugin Model B instead the one by company A makes the difference in the big picture of the song as a whole
• Get to know your plugins in and out and when to use which one (Don't use presets)!
• Make sure the plugin covers a wide range of computer systems and plugin formats, so you can use it in the future and on different operating systems)!

Okay, I'm done. You can flame me now.

[EDIT:]

I forgot some important ingredients to the remedy…

Plugin Management: If you use a DAW which allows you to create your own categories/folders for plugins, I highly recommend doing so. Because it helps you a) to keep track of all the plugins you own, b) it helps you picking a useful plugin easier. If you look in your FET Folder after it and you find more than 2 Models of an 1176 Compressor in there, it's probably also a good idea to re-evaluate why you do have them and ask yourself if your really need them?

Here's an example of how I have organized my Comps and EQs inside Logic:





For me, it works best to have my plugins like Channel Strips, Compressors and EQs organized by either Topology (mainly for Comps, because of their different behaviors) or by Vendor. You could also organize them by type of Instruments you use them on. However you go about it, having some sort of personalized structure will help you speed up your workflow and decision making so that you can really focus on actually creating music again rather than fiddeling with the technical meta level of it.

Here's another Thread of mine with some PDFs, listing Analog Hardware EQs and Compressors, their specifics, what they can be used for, which companies provide a plugin version: https://audiosex.pro/threads/5teezos-analog-modeled-audio-plugin-lists.30646/

Other positiv effects and benefits of not hording plugins i.e. limiting your choises, are:

• saving money (obviously)
• your skill set in decison making will increase because you are not compensating missing elements of a song with plugins but with instruemts/sounds
• having an overall better experience when making music because it's more intuitive and you won't be overwhelmed by the sheer amount of plugins you can chose frome
• In the end, you will become a better Musician/Producer because you focus your energy on the fundamental levels of music: sounds, compositon and arrangement – especially if you produce sample-based or electronic music.

If you don't believe me, try this experiment: create a Beat/Song/Project using only one Channel Strip Plugin and a clean EQ per channel/bus and some modulation effects on send returns (1 chorus/doubler, 1 delay and 1 reverb and maybe an 1176 for Slamming Drums on a Parallel Channel). Put a MixBus Compresor, EQ and Limiter on your Mixbus. Let's assume these are all the plugins you have. Then you know what to do: get the sound right at the lowest level: synth programming, composition (melodies, harmonies, voicings), volume balance, stereo panorama, EQ. If you do that, I guarantee you, you will be really satisfied, because you aimed your energy in the right direction. Also, the mix will sound more coherent in the end.

 

Last edited: May 12, 2019

none

 

That my friend you spoke the gospel thruth!

 

Completely agree. The plugin market is driven by ppl who don't have mixing skills - me included. I recently made a huge progress in that part of my production. Now I'm getting where i want MUCH faster regardless of the plugins I use.

Thank Universe for AudioZ! Otherwise, I would be completely broke and with the same noob mixes...

 

This is really undifferentiated. But pretty much everything stated is and I really do not like those "analyzing" stuff because it's mostly very undifferentiated and they present only problems but never solutions. It's like telling someone about your business plan. Everyone has a hell lot of problems to tell but no one has a solution.

A lot of those mixing engineers have a lot of plugins because they want to try them out. A lot of mastering engineers have a lot of hardware processors because they want to try them out . That they will use maybe just a few of them has nothing to do with this "psychological" stuff but more with figuring out what they can work with. And if someone can not mix something properly with a couple of packs from plugin developers then he simply has a lack of some fundamental methodical knowledge. But most people have those problems. This is nothing new. Especially nothing new in the society. People always say "ooohhhh our society is so strange". But the lack of methodical knowledge is nothing new as I said.

Nice to read but mostly it's stuff that is to be honest not so correct, undifferentiated or most people already do know about it.

Edit: And why is it relevant if someone has 2, 3, 5 or more than 5 plugins of the same model? Does it make a difference if someone has 3 or 5? And if so which relevance does it have?
It's basically just a more drastic type of this not so good "psychological" stuff.
Nothing relevant.

 

Last edited: May 9, 2019

Totally agree.

You realize that you have 20 compressors, 20 reverbs, 20 delays, ..... and on the one hand it is a waste of time. on the other they are more possibilities.

The key is not that YOU USE. but how you use it to reach the final sound. Because at the end, the result is sound, it does not matter how you got it. That you create with those tools (plugins/hard) that will be of better or worse quality, but that YOU, you will use them in a way to create something, regardless of whether they are good or bad.
I have always said that there is no plugins or hardware with the "best" knob is the person who used the plugins or hard to create sound, no better or worse sound.

Michael Jackson or Daft Punk, would not they be if they had played with another compressor, mixer or delays?
Brian May would be another with another guitar?

 

You won't ever get anywhere if you don't have skin in the game.

 

The way you quoted me is makes it look like I was generalizing which I wasn't. I was specifically refering to musicians/producers hording specific kinds plugins in hope of becomming better artists. And also, how the whole eco-system behind the plugin industry works. I don't know what is "undifferentiated" about that.

Second, I was trying to give an explanation of a very specific phenomenon, hording specific mixing plugins - and why I think this is happening. And that's where psychology has to be taken into account. I think that's far from "undifferntiated" as well.

The poll is not a serious attempt to measure anything empirical. It's more of a hint for users to self-reflect on their use or not use of plugins.

Honestly, the way you comment is pretty arrogant! I was trying to explanation of why I think a social phenomenon like this is happening and the only thing you can come up with in response is "undiffernetiated" and "Nothing relevant". If it was so irrelevant you could just have done something else in the meantime.

And since you seem to really care a lot about diffenrtiating and relevance, I have a little gem for you now: If somebody critizes someone else about being "undifferentiated" about something, the least I expect is an argument behind this claim. But as of now what you said is just your opinion – nothing more. But I was not giving out an opinion I was making an arguement. And that is the actual difference between something irrelevant and something meaningful.

 

Yes and I've said what those arguments are.
And meaningful are only things that are correct in all aspects and circumstances. In other words: Fundamental.

So, to end this, I really do not understand what this means:

Why is this stated? I pretty often read those kind of statements at the end of some very long and "meaningful" posts and I begin to feel that this is only stated because of preventing exactly this. It's not a good rhetoric I have to say.

I know I'am a bit baldly. But if someone leaves those kind of "big" statements, I think he has to deal with someone criticising everything simplistic. It's the same for the "foster-guy" as for everyone else.

 

Last edited: May 9, 2019

if there were no "try before you buy" versions I would only use the stock plugins from the daw. I'm sure the result would be the same

 

You're not baldly. Acrually, your criticism doesn't hold any weight. Because all you do is discredit the argumentation by calling the arguments made "irrelevant" and "fundamentally wrong" without providing any counter evidence to proof your point whatsoever.

 

Any resemblance to posts by the troll artist formally known as Foster and this original, thoughtful post of 5teezo's is non-existent and makes me shake my head in wonder at what the point of Lieglein's teardown really is all about. Argument for argument's sake is rather wasteful, not educational and carries not the discussion forward. It is a road to nowhere, fast.

 

Runners obsess about running shoes, dentists about dental drills, so it's quite alright for a mix engineer to obsess about his mixing tools. Part and parcel, you expect that from a semi-autistic specialist.

 

I'm obsess in AudioZ.

 

I made my account just to agree to how f***ing true this is!

 

We are terribly spoiled these days. I choose to limit myself and a large part of that is having a sense of pride in working for and ultimately owning what I use. Not having a lot of money forces me to prioritize, buying what I absolutely need first and often only for some time. I have to save months, sometimes a couple years, sacrificing immediate satisfactions across the board, to get what I want/need. I've also gone back to using hardware, (much of which I already saved for and bought over the last 20 years) which I prefer, if and wherever possible which further limits me.

You're right, for the average listener gear is not even on their radar, Cheetos and the latest tweets/Instagram/ect is while the music plays in the background from their mp3 player or smartphone.

I have 3 software compressors (likely the three you'd expect) that weren't included with my DAW. I have zero plans on getting another and if I do it will be to replace one. I don't collect, well anything. If it's not useful or somehow an investment, in the trash or to someone else it goes.

That all said, this is my hobby, a hobby I prioritize over most things, but it's not my bread and butter, so to speak. I don't tend to eat bread, and never butter. <---- I like this little guy. Trips me out.

 

@5teezo Thank you for this post! It was much needed. Everyone needs to get off of this crazy commercialized carousel of clowns and get over the "Neu-gierde" disease.

 

i wrote a longwinded post comming from a philosophical angel. But deleted it all because, who am i talking too really?

the question you (who ever reads this) must come to terms with is: At the end of the day, are you a consumer or a creator
if you dont like your owne answer, you have the power to change your attitude/mind

 

Certainly it depends on the kind of musical product you are making and the intended audience. It is well known that a lot of people can't tell the difference between Neve and a homemade Reaktor channel strip, but that is not what they listen for, or how they listen. But if you are working for a somewhat more discerning (demanding) public then you do indeed have to find the plug-in that gets what you want.... and thanks to AudioZ you can do thorough testing before you purchase what is necessary. For example I have tried out tens of limiters until I found the one that does what I require most of the time, but in the meantime I have found that the others have their zones of optimum efficiency for adding interest in a specific context, so they are useful as well.
And this is true even moreso for reverbs. Context is the key notion here. If you are looking for "natural" sound, then any one of a dozen or so will get you that effect especially when buried in a complex mix where the details (again for a certain kind of listener) are not important. But EVERY verb has its own characteristics, such that when you use the unit as a signal processor-transformer-evolver, each one can produce a different quality for different source sounds. AudioZ allows me to do in-depth evaluation of verb units, and I regularly wind up purchasing the ones that can make significant contributions to my timbral pallette. Well, the ones I can afford, anyway.
Bottom line: there is no hard and fast rule. If you need a lot of variety you need a lot of plug-ins, if not, not.