OK I am not a newbie when it comes to computer based music production. I used to sell software for a music store. However, I am not sure what the fuss is about 64 bit computing and why all of my software seems to be moving towards it. I use Mixcraft because it is easy to use with very little problems. I have used it since 2010. With the last two versions it has been available in a 64 bits edition. While most of my software also run 64 bit, I still use the 32 bit version because of all of the plugins that I use that is only 32 bit. Can someone tell me what is the advantage of using the higher bit rate? I mean, to me my projects just don't sound any different to me, just without a few of my favorite plug ins. Thanks

http://newsletter.native-instrument...date+b=Komplete+t=Update_PD&utm_content=owned

 

As said, it's about 64-bit computer architecture, meaning access to higher usage of RAM.
Not related to audio quality, nor audio bit depth (not bit rate as you wrote).

 

64bit processing is nothing to do what so ever to do with bit rate of audio, its a better system meaning you can use more ram than 32bit, 32bit can only acess 4gb of ram, 64bit depending on your motherboard can acess up to 64gb of ram period

 

I'm not entirely sure, but my understanding is that some programs are written so that two 32-bit instructions can be executed with one cycle of a 64-bit system. A program like that tends to run a lot faster as a result. It is also my understanding that there isn't too much software out there that does take advantage of this. Otherwise, as the other folks here have mentioned, the 64-bit structure has nothing to do with audio quality. Come to think of it, it would be nice if it DID!! If anybody knows something about 64-bit instructions it would be nice to hear from you.

 

The 64-bit version of Mixcraft has native bridging for 32-bit plugins. Acoustica have optimized recent builds of Mixcraft so that 32-bit plugins will be bridged more efficiently (supposedly).

 

Those are rookie numbers (I guess we all know this meme so I simpyl quoted it)...it can handle more:
https://superuser.com/questions/556008/memory-limits-in-16-32-and-64-bit-systems
OS and motherboards are the limits here.. ;)

 

Pretty sure that this only affects the amount of RAM that can be accessed (by 64 bit addressing) rather than being able to do a math operation on a 64 bit operator using half the cycles of the 32 bit architecture.
Been awhile since I've done any assembly or c++ though, so perhaps someone can chime in on that who is in the know.

 

Hi. As it was mentioned 64bit OS and software architecture has nothing to do with the audio quality. So for the OS ,Win7 Pro/Ultimate can address up to 192 gb of ram and Win10 Pro up to 2tb. If you are wondering if there are motherboards that support this much ram, yes there are in the server/workstation market. In the desktop market typical mobos support up to 64gb and the high end line desktop series for both Intel and AMD based platforms can have up to 128gb.
To the more interesting bits now, the most important reason to switch to 64bit is, apps compiled in 64bit can be up to about 20% (or more) faster than the exact same app compiled in 32bit. But how is this possible? In short, it is a combination of x64 cpu architecture and ram space.
And in some detail:
From the cpu side and as simple as i can explain, modern x64 cpus along with 64bit OS & apps, handle specific "instructions" that in the past 32bit gens had to be loaded and saved in system memory. In accordance with Windows Os's, any Win32 has a big bunch of these low level cpu coding instructions, known as "calling conventions". Win64 systems though, have simplified this and have only one, which is a sibling of the "fastcall" calling instruction found in Win32 (which in practice is the most rapid in execution as well).
By using this simplified version of the "fastcall" when coding apps for 64bit operation and in conjuction with newer x64 cpu architecture, typical 64bit application cpu function calls are now passed straight through ultra fast cpu registers instead of being loaded/saved to system memory and then processed, which is also reducing the time to call them.
From the ram side of things, the extended address space in 64 bit systems allows x64 apps that can use large amounts of ram (such as daws & sample based Vsti plugs for example), to store all the data they need in the main system ram without the need to swap that data to disk, as opposed to how 32bit systems with a 4gb ram limit "behave".
We shouldn't forget that 32bit apps in a 64bit Win OS, still make use of the WoW64 layer that emulates a 32bit system rendering these apps by definition 2-5 % slower and in some occasions even more.
To our music now:
Given that any modern desktop system optimized for DAW operation can easily have anywhere from 16gb up to 128gb ram (and if you have money to burn many times that with a server comp) the benefit to move to a full x64 system is tremendous, needless to say it's a must.
Add to this, that 99% of the music apps and plugs have all been re-compiled @ 64bit the last 10 years, with the more popular apps to also have been refined the past 3-4 years to make even smarter use of the available ram and specific 64bit cpu instructions, there is little to no excuse to keep working at 32bit if you have a computer built in the last decade or newer.
Lastly, i am not a computer scientist, my best friend and partner in custom computer builds is, my knowledge of systems comes from "fiddling" experience, some reading and of course keeping the "right" company hehe. I hope what i wrote was understandable, feel free to correct me if you found anything wrong in what i wrote.
All the best, cheers

 

Last edited: Mar 9, 2018

This tool allows you can use all of your installed RAM in a 32bit OS without any limitation. Don't forget to log in on as administrator and follow the procedures inside readme.txt.

For the newer version, check out:
https://github.com/wj32/PatchPae2

I've tested it on Windows 8.1 (32 bit) for years and worked fine. All applications work without any error. The only weakness would be the programs not being able to handle more memory that has been defined for them. Other than that the OS can easily access to all of your RAM.

 

Last edited by a moderator: Mar 8, 2018

Its NOT as simple as 32+32=64 so it's faster.

The 64bit architechture (AMD64) has more registers inside the CPU which is why it's up to %10 faster

SIMD, SSE, AVX can make things faster, but that has less to do with 32/64b.

 

Last edited: Mar 9, 2018

Thanks everyone. I knew someone here would be able to give me a better understanding of this. AS I said earlier I had played around with 64 bit every so often but had not noticed any difference between systems. Many of the old plug in that I use are from 2004 or even earlier (been using computer to make music since 1996), so I doubt if those have been ported over. I did not know that Mixcraft had native bridging. Will need to look into using it more often. BTW my computer is a 64 bit machine Win 10 with 12 gigs of ram. I just ran this program in 32 bit all the time.

 

Last edited: Mar 8, 2018

I think people gave you enough descriptions.

32bit applications run faster on 32bit OSs but with limited amount of RAM. That's it. Audio quality of production doesn't pertain to OS's architecture.

There's another 32 and 64 bit that those terms being used inside DAWs and don't relate to 32 and 64 bit OSs.

Also the solution I posted is for the situation that you insist to use a 32bit OS with accessing the whole RAM.

As a conclusion there are three kinds of "32bit and 64bit":
1- 32bit and 64bit OS
2- 32bit and 64bit application
3- 32bit and 64bit audio processing (this one affects the audio quality)

Number 3 is independent of 1 and 2.

 

Last edited by a moderator: Mar 9, 2018

Are you sure 32bit applications run faster on 32bit OS's, is it much faster?
So if you install a 32 bit Apps on a 64 bit OS you should use the 32 bit plugins I guess. I'm guessing but you probably cannot install 64 bit Apps on a 32 bit OS, but 32 bit Apps on 64 bit OS goes fine.
My music system is all 64 bit by the way, OS and Apps.....

I'm into MAME and other emulators and it's all in 32 bit Apps on a 32 bit OS. Hope I just can move the folder into a 64 bit OS with no problems if I want to do that in the future. It is just folders with .exe files no actual installations for the most part.

 

In my head I read the title like Jerry Seinfeld...that is all, have a good day.

 

Errr. Nope. They are meant to run on 32bit sys lol. That is they don't run faster, because apps themselves are just code, they cannot exceed their "spec". They can only run slightly slower and this is when they 're used in a 64bit OS because then the OS is mimicking a 32bit environment and the realtime conversion takes a small toll on your app's performance. With modern cpus you will hardly notice any difference apart from some very rare exceptions. Take sometime and read what i wrote earlier, you 'll understand. I guess.

It depends. If you want to use plugs which make heavy ram usage like NI Kontakt with a 32bit daw like Cubase 5 for example, you can install the x64 version of Kontakt and use JBridge to make a 32bit bridged version of it so your 32bit daw can use it. The plug itself will still comply with the x64 paradigm because the bridged dll is just -for my lack of a better description- a converted shell. This means while the bridged plug itself will appear in your DAW as 32bit, it will actually use all the ram that is available to it through the OS like it was 64bit.

You guessed right in this one.

Just copy paste your MAME folder with the emulator and the roms from the 32bit comp, to a hard disk in your 64bit comp. Run MAME, load WonderBoy (fuck yeah), enjoy the 8bit nostalgia.

 

Last edited: Mar 9, 2018

And to complicate things in some cases 64-bit even leads to a slowdown due to the doubled instructions size (less instructions fit into the caches, more data needs to be fetched from RAM and devices etc.pp.).

 

I too use Mame 32 and 64 bit. Both work on 64bit architecture.

 

Not a commonly perceived problem, IMO, but the reverse of this, when utilised correctly, means faster processing (less push-pull by the CPU). Good 64 bit programs should be a little more efficient and a little faster. This is often immeasurable for most apps but for others you can find a nice difference (albeit not mind-blowing). The real advantage is the memory addressing as specified throughout this thread which for all of our DAWS is a HUGE thing.

 

That's right. But it's extremely difficult to implement. It's called vectorization.
If I'm right it's not exactly proportional with the 2x number of bits but something similar.
It has to do with the famous SIMD operations (SSE2 and so on, I think there are until SSD5 and even another ones for the latest CPUs). It stands for Single instruction multiple data, so that would be it. Two, tree or more operations of the same kind in one CPU cycle and core.
They are special commands who use special registers (CPU internal memory) and even within the x64 architecture there are big differences.