I agree except for the last sentence, a real mastering engineer lives in his studio (or vice versa).

a true mastering engineer is useless (as a mastering engineer) in a fully treated room with the right equipment,
if it's a studio which he is not familiar with.

if it's at his home it's a +

 

to say it is a gimmick, is to misunderstand what it is capable of, which specific things it can accomplish and how to do that with it. the only plugins i would consider gimmick are those which cannot accomplish anything ( haven't found one of those yet)

here is challenge
whatever you use to "master"

take a 90's track and remaster it in 5 mins , to today's standards

i can do that with lurssen mastering console ( if it can do that ,how could it possibly be a gimmick?)
the plugin re-acts exactly like one of my previous mastering chain hardware setups,
where as any other mastering tools or plugins (software) don't re-act like that.
so i consider it a tool to accomplish a specific set of criteria,
what determines if i need to do that specific set of tasks?
the unique finger print of the track you are working with.
here is my point, the plug does specific things i havnet found another mastering plugin to be able to accomplish, this means it cannot be a gimmick.
now even IF many other plugins do the exact SAME thing as lurssen, you could only say it can accomplish certain things you can also achieve another way if you want, that is to say it is a tool for a job , there if you need it. so again it could not be considered a gimmick.

 

Last edited: Jun 30, 2017

Does your ITB mastering comply with the Red Book Compact Disc specifications standard for audio CDs. It allows for storage of additional information (e.g. album name, song name, and artist) on a standards-compliant audio CD.
Do you embed ISRC codes? The unique code for globally identifying an individual sound recording?
Is your room treated for mastering? Do you have monitors that you can rely on giving results that will guarantee exact and precise standards across all media?
I think you are saying you can make your own tracks sound great with a couple of hundred dollar plugins. I can do that too, but I don't kid myself I'm mastering.
And yes, I could hook you up with a good friend who has been mastering for 25 years who would shake his head at the idea that the work he does on a 90's track would take five minutes with a plugin.
I believe you are mistaking mastering for "polishing up" a track.
Read Bob Katz's book on mastering and learn something from a genuine expert.

 

I'm not trying to be inflammatory or derogatory to anybody here. I am trying to clarify the real purpose of mastering. I'm sure MMJ2017, you produce excellent sounding tracks. You know the processes involved, I do too and for commercial album releases I have had attended mastering sessions where my fixes on a single track have been pointed out to me as being detrimental to the overall sound of the album. I couldn't hear them at home, but when A/B'd on high end monitors, I could see my errors.

 

I have read Bob Katz. he is better than me he will probably be always better than me. i first cracked open his material in 1998. since then ( nothing special about me) I have been mastering. there is something important to say here. like most things i didn't actually start to get good at mastering until the 500th or more song I mastered.


"
Does your ITB mastering comply with the Red Book Compact Disc specifications standard for audio CDs. It allows for storage of additional information (e.g. album name, song name, and artist) on a standards-compliant audio CD.
Do you embed ISRC codes? The unique code for globally identifying an individual sound recording?
Is your room treated for mastering? Do you have monitors that you can rely on giving results that will guarantee exact and precise standards across all media?"

yes.


"And yes, I could hook you up with a good friend who has been mastering for 25 years who would shake his head at the idea that the work he does on a 90's track would take five minutes with a plugin."

see, now you demonstrating that either you didnt actually read my comment, or you are trying to manipulate to twist the meaning around.
what i said was regarding a specific context of RE_MASTERING a song.
can you take a well mastered song from 1997 lets say and in ozone or whatever you use, bring it upto today's standards with RE-MASTERING in 5 minutes of time?

I didn't say do the whole thing from scratch in 5 mins, your comments are just all over the place and talking about random things.



"
Does your ITB mastering comply with the Red Book Compact Disc specifications standard for audio CDs. It allows for storage of additional information (e.g. album name, song name, and artist) on a standards-compliant audio CD.
Do you embed ISRC codes? The unique code for globally identifying an individual sound recording?"

here, again
well let me ask you how relevant do you thing this is to mastering for Itunes or flac or AAc files? files going on youtube or a flashdrive?
its such a bizarre question to ask. when cd's are at least 7 years obsolete by any standard i know of , computers that are used to make music or engineer no longer have cd burners for christ sake! (maybe you said it as a joke after all and that is the reason? if so its kind of a good one:D)


"I believe you are mistaking mastering for "polishing up" a track."

in what regard specifically? If i AM making a mistake point it out to me the exact moment in time it happened and what about it was mistaken that is what i have done with yourself after all.



". I am trying to clarify the real purpose of mastering"


how are you doing that? where in what specific sentence do you do this?

"
I have had attended mastering sessions where my fixes on a single track have been pointed out to me as being detrimental to the overall sound of the album. I couldn't hear them at home, but when A/B'd on high end monitors, I could see my errors.
"

if this is true why are you lecturing myself that has been doing mastering for 19 years ? ( again it dont make me anyone special or valuable but it also means i call bullshit when i see it.)


"Is your room treated for mastering? Do you have monitors that you can rely on giving results that will guarantee exact and precise standards across all media?"


you see i dont get what relevance your question has or the point in it. many times i use these
https://www.audioadvice.com/astell-...DuEC9uHfNkop8bMKZAnQbTaw2x388iyQvUaAv-l8P8HAQ
because i have to work on the go on a laptop . for mastering all you need is 1. playback system accurate enough to show all possible detail. and 2. enough critical listening skills to evaluate reference material 3. enough time to know what a playback system sounds like.
my whole point is your question is irrelvant I could answer no to having a proper treated "mastering room" (whatever that is haha)(there is no standard mastering room that everyone conforms to regarding reflections ,refractions and frequency response slope their all different)
and the question you asked would only point out your ability to seem like you know what you are talking about.
(note the rest of the time i master on large field monitors )

"I'm not trying to be inflammatory or derogatory to anybody here."

then why make the choices that you have regarding what you have specifically said?

 

Last edited: Jul 1, 2017

tooloud I have a question for you. lets find out once and for all if lurssen plugin is a gimmick in your mind.
Imagine if your favorite mastering engineer ( pick the best one you know of)
got a last minute job for a top 40 song by a major label , it was unconventional in that he agrees to help, walks into a room with high end laptop which is not his and is told all he has is lurssen plugin to entirely master a mix to completion in a 4 hour window lets say sitting in this conference room with some in ear monitors of his choice ( mastering quality)
now, are you honestly saying that this mastering engineer is totally NOT CAPABLE of accomplishing this task for a great deal of money such that he would be proud of the result?
(note: you would have to answer NO he cannot do it , if it is in fact the case in reality that the lurssen plugin is a gimmick because in order to be a gimmick it couldn't be capable of accomplishing such a task(which is common practice nowadays i must say for a skilled mastering engineer to have a mobile workstation on the go)

 

Okay. I get it. You're a pro and I'm wrong and have been for a long time about mastering.

 

Last edited by a moderator: Jul 1, 2017

I don't see it that way. lets just call me experienced ( many here are and many all over are) and im taking the time to talk to you because theoretically if someone was mistaken and then shown about it , that would elevate the person higher, we all do it and def need that. I think we can agree we all will be wrong again soon lol and hopefully someone can show us and overall our experience grows. ( THAT is the way i see it my friend)

 

Can you direct me to samples of your work? A website? Any artists? A list of testimonials?

 

Last edited by a moderator: Jul 1, 2017

A friend of mine has been reading your posts and having a good laugh at your technique. He is a genuine mastering engineer. He doesn't work from a laptop with ear buds. Tell him all that equipment he uses is useless and all he needs is one plugin.
Here's a list of his clients:

Coldplay, Elton John, Kanye West, Lady Gaga, Muse, Jay-Z, Metallica, The Black Eyed Peas, U2, Snoop Dogg, Tiesto, Lana Del Rey, George Michael, Kiss, David Bowie, Prince, Bob Dylan, Stevie Nicks.

https://studios301.com/online-mastering/mastering-engineers/ben-feggans/

 

and what do you suppose this could accomplish regarding this specific conversation regarding IF lurssen plugin is in fact a gimmick ?( incapable of doing what is on the tin)
and even IF i do that are you saying it would be valuable just to believe whatever i said because i had some authority? either way it is irrelevant. ALL we have to do is evaluate each individual claim the both of us make, check against reality to see if it holds up or not.
I WOULD be up for a real-time contest or challenge just for fun with set criteria (instead relying on the past concept of authority) for example give me a challenge to use lurssen plugin with compared to something with different tools ( ozone whatever)in order to see results if it is fact lurssen incapable of mastering.( that is the claim after-all)my only claim is that lurssen plugin is a tool it does what it says it does and i use it, nothing extra-ordinary here.
example think of something lurssen is is incapable of doing as advertised ( eveidence of being a gimmick)

 

Last edited: Jul 1, 2017

I thought so. Check and Mate. Game over buddy.

 

i don't know what any of this means.

having a good laugh at my technique in which exact context?
why would I tell him that "equimpement he uses is useless and all he needs is one plugin"?
you think i claimed this by saying lurssen plugin is not a gimmick that implies all this?
what does his list of clients establish regarding this convo? is HE making a claim that the plugin is a gimmick? or YOU?
has HE tried it? have YOU?
I cant understand any of what your saying friend.

 

what is "so" that you thought?
what is the check mate game over buddy thing?
I demonstrated how there is no rational connection between previous anything and this exact conversation.
it has to be evaluated in the present not the past. for all you know i could lie and just pretend to be some famous dude show all his stuff or even if i did show you all my own stuff how could it rationally connect to THIS convo?
your talking strange my friend.
its like your saying the only way for a sentence of mine to be factual in its content in the context of reality, is if i have a specific backstory, but reality does not work that way a statement is factual or not based on its own merit, not any appeals to authority.

lets take
"human beings are literally made of trillions of living cells."
if a 5 year old says this, it is correct if a 78 year old says it it is correct if a blind man or mailman says it, why? because we evaluate claims based on their own merit not appeals to authority.
here is naother example

" there exists a hum,an being with 564,723 arms on earth"

if a 5 year old says it is is wrong. if bill gates says it it is wrong if dr dre says it is it wrong if a homeless man says it, it is wrong. why? because we evaluate claims based on the the content itself not who or where it came from.

 

Last edited: Jul 1, 2017

I see nothing confusing about what I said or the view of my accomplished mastering engineer friend. And your lack of proof of your work does little to add legitimacy to your claims. I gave you a website with verified credentials working with major artists and you still find confusion.
I will summarise and clarify. Both myself and Mr Feggans find the idea that top quality mastering can be done with the Lurssen plugin alone to be laughable.

 

okay cool, lets see if we have the "story" straight (since your not confusing)
Please correct me if i am wrong here by all means.

we only have 2 options to pick from in your mind A or B

A. Lurssen plugin is a gimmick

or

B. lurssen plugin can replace everything you own as a mastering engineer do the job of every piece of gear you had, and therefore is not a gimmick.


there CANNOT be a third option for example C. lurssen plugin is not a gimmick because it is a mastering tool that can do a job as advertised like any other plugin ( in capable hands)

in your mind it MUST be a plugin which replaces a entire mastering facility to not be a gimmick and if it does not hold up to that it IS a gimmick? do you hold ozone or any other plugin to that standard?

this is what you said

..". Tell him all that equipment he uses is useless and all he needs is one plugin.."
this is the standard for it NOT be a gimmick?
for me i find that bizarre, my standard is that it does at least 1 single thing well, (like i hold to any other plugin) for it to NOT be a gimmick. ( it actually does more than 1 though)

 

A. Lurssen plugin is a gimmick

...and we still have no evidence of your work with this plugin with any artists. But we did get an anecdote about a human with 564,000 arms.... and you call me confusing.

 

give me something of yours ( so that you know I am the one doing it.) I will make a video showing the original you gave me which i can play through in the video so you can verify it is in the condition you sent it in, i will master with the 1 single plugin just to try to show it can do something valuable and that it is not a gimmick and then post the video right away so you can see the entire elapsed time frame and what was done exactly. ( or you could do that yourself actually try it out see if it works) it is just a plugin that does what it says and no more a gimmick than any other plugin.
actually i take all tha back, i just got an idea since you are the one making the claim show the burden of proof.
make a video with a song unmastered play through it A to B with lurssen on and off ( to the original) demonstrating to us all that on your system the way your using it it is impossible that lurssen plugin can master anything, that it cannot do a single thing
once you do that I will make the video above as I mentioned but im only going to take the time if you do it first, show that your serious that it is a gimmick and i will continue. (show your not a troll)

 

Last edited: Jul 1, 2017

I am NOT a mastering engineer. I have never claimed to be one. You are failing every time I ask you for your credentials and examples of your work. The burden of proof is on you since you are making the claim.
You're not the only person who can use Lurssen to add some bass, some top end, compress everything then zero db the whole signal with a limiter and bingo! Doesn't it sound great and it took me five minutes.

 

your not a mastering engineer, therefore you say a plugin developed for use by mastering engineers is a gimmick and does not work.

got it.

I am not a mechanic therefore a wrench is a gimmick because i cannot hammer in nails right with it.

also i need to have high credentials to say it works as a plugin, and you need zero credentials to say you are no mastering engineer and it is for mastering engineers but it is a gimmick and does not work got it.

lurssen is not a add and twist random knobs with no understand of what you are doing, you are supposed to use it to do specific things the track requires, and you said you where here to talk about what mastering is then you proceed to describe throwing it on and doing random things which is NOT mastering i think you have demonstrated everything we needed to talk about thanks for your conversation friend it was nice talking with you about this topic.

this is just a side note i think you may find enjoyable( im watching it right now)

 

Last edited: Jul 1, 2017