Let's say you wrote a book on the paper that you made and gave it a title "The truth according to MMJ2017".
Now explain what is this book in reality (and how it is devoid of meaning).
Also since everything you know is a shortcut, that makes reality a fiction and your world of shortcuts a reality.

 

There are dictionaries you can use to be able to take part in a more adult manner than you are doing right now.

 

Area 1 - unless you start examining reality directly bypassing the symbols of mind it isn't accessible
For example in your dream things also work in its own way and you continue identifying with a part of your minds that feels like you mind/body combo and the rest is outside. When you wake up you understand everything was your mind.
You just didn't wake up about the bigger dream yet.

Area 2 - I'd say there is no accurate distinction between human mind and Reality because it is the same dreamy world that just appears as it is, more real on some level, more fictional on another, all that for a brief moment you are alive and very soon the whole dreamworld disappears with you when you aren't.

 

He just carries out a cultural reprisal against the theorists (you and me).

 

By enslaved I mean the process/activity/state of mind which keeps you from realizing who you really are because you're focused on a "wrong" thing.
If on the other hand you entertain a process that will dissolve fake identifications about who you are and what reality is your mind will expand and this process is opposite to enslavement. Lets say a liberation.

 

In reality, especially in the reality of this thread so much is about your version of the map which we patiently read from page to page.
This is very benign map and you are open for discussion which is very refreshing and thank you for that but there are other people and civilizations which force their map upon people thus creating very tangible realities for them which don't make them happy.
It cannot be proved without crossing over to wake you up but let me say, there is no such thing as a reality in a way you are imagining to be i.e. "What is Actually is and we are only finding out about it". There is a mixture of basic ingredients upon which we are imposing never seen realities using or always wrong maps, imagination and fantasies.

 

I beg to differ. He actually commented about noise and really added to the noise of the thread ;-)
Which reminds me what to my parents was irritating noise to me it was the most beautiful music I could make.

 

To say that reality is fiction because we must use our senses to access it (or data from/about it) is an rather uninformed play with words witout merit, imho.

 

"because when you look at atom you are only looking to what atom is to you."

I dont know what you mean by this,

If you have 30 scientists in a room with an electron microscope, each walks over looks at it, they all see the same thing, that is NOT
"what an atom looks like to you"





"If you start thinking how an atom is not what you learned it is you'll create a new way of looking at it."

so, im thinking of an atom as a bucket of chicken with a side of gravy is that a "new way of looking at it?"









"You'll keep imagining that there is an atom which you will continue to find about until you find out it is alive and it might change according to your actions which are results of your will."


I dont know what you mean by this, atoms are not alive. they never change according to your actions.

If you have 30 scientists in a room with an electron microscope, each walks over looks at it, they all see the same thing, that is NOT
"what an atom looks like to you"






"And btw you'll never know what atom is per se, that is unless your mind becomes one with it."

how does your mind "become one with it?"

 

Don't worry, almost the whole world is with you on that.
On the other hand in your dream you have access to you imaginary body and you keep "perceiving" dream of your mind as if it is real.
And it is... to you... but what would you say about that reality to yourself from this supposedly wakeful state?

 

I dont follow.


"everything you know is a shortcut"

words are a shortcut, instead describing listing every atom, every organ we say human being "for short"

 

you are now talking about societies? about how people force things on others?





"there is no such thing as a reality"

so to you rick grimes from the walking dead and you yourself are identical beings? that santa claus and bill gates are?
how do you build computers? how do you build cars? bridges? if there is NO " the way things work"

because i have told you many many times the word i use "reality" is a shortcut to say " the way things actually work"




"This is very benign map"
how so?



"It cannot be proved without crossing over to wake you up"
what does this mean to YOU?



"There is a mixture of basic ingredients upon which we are imposing never seen realities using or always wrong maps, imagination and fantasies.["

I dont follow

 

but you are not an actual person saying this you are identical with a fictional character because there is no reality in which you exist according to you.

 

can you expand on this ? im having hard time understanding what you mean in which context.

i think i get it but go on

are you referring to the fake fiction people create as a story about themselves when they do not differentiate fiction from NOT fiction?

 

If I never existed if you never existed if no one ever existed reality would be the same. things would work the same way they do.

 

You are in a whole different league than MMJ2017, so don't expect to even understand your questions not to say answering them.
If you wish you can continue talking to him but I would suggest to search from the Physics aspect what Minkowski space is.

The reality we all experience is a direct product of our biology. Humans that have more or less the same biology they share the same reality. Humans that have a different biology from a degenerative disease have a different reality.

The perceived reality is a 3D pseudo Euclidean with the Time being sensed only by the changes it causes to the physical system we observe.
The "real" reality we can only fumble through Mathematics is a non Euclidean 4D.

A good start is here and you can move on knowing what you are searching for.

The above is purely Physics and Mathematics although it begs Philosophical and Religious questions and views (on that video there is a reference of Zen and I can write for Christianity but that's not the point right now)

This 4D non Euclidean it's like a "soup" of energy that is "boiling" and vibrating forming clusters of different densities. These clusters and its vibrations and density variations are perceived by human minds through our limited (and arbitrary (?) calibrated by whoever or whatever) senses as stars, planets, mountains, oceans, plants, trees, atoms, particles, other beings, other human beings etc

When you die you'll leave behind this biology and you'll "wake up" in a more real reality and your new "superior" biology will identify as a "dream" your current life due to the "lower" biology used to spark this dream in the first place. Just like the common dream that uses a smaller "part" of our biology to get started but when we use our "whole" biology (awaken) we identify our previous state as a dream.

The death here (just an assumption/sleeping and not a big deal for Christianity) is the awakening elsewhere and you have to be prepared (the real deal for most of the religions)...

 

Last edited: Apr 23, 2017

"unless you start examining reality directly bypassing the symbols of mind it isn't accessible"

I dont understand what you mean.






"For example in your dream things also work in its own way"


no this is false, the dream state is all over the place constantly changing , there is no way things work ,one dream you cant even stand , one dream your lfying one dream everything is clear, one is blurry, one dream ever second your in a new place, one dream is just colors changing , one dream you try to yell or talk you cannot, one dream something chasing you.




"
You just didn't wake up about the bigger dream yet."

can you explain how this statement is not false or fake or fiction?

i could say " You just didn't go to sleep and start to dream yet"

show me yours is right mine is wrong.






"Area 2 - I'd say there is no accurate distinction between human mind and Reality because it is the same dreamy world that just appears as it is, more real on some level, more fictional on another, all that for a brief moment you are alive and very soon the whole dreamworld disappears with you when you aren't.[/QUOTE]"

if this was true we would see a different world than we do, there woul be no physics no electricityno gravity no quantum level no modern medicine no human organs no ice cubs forming when water gets cold and on and on.

 

so what exact significance do you think you are bringing to the conversation?



"You are in a whole different league than MMJ2017, so don't expect to even understand your questions not to say answering them."

here is an idea, formulate a refutation of every individual senetnce I speak proposition I make show the whole world that "so don't expect to even understand your questions not to say answering them."" is true , its like the guy that goes around yelling " I have a bigger ***k than YOU" , but in reality the person that does does not go around saying it , they go around using it. Demonstrate that it is the case I am wrong or that you are superior to me where alll can see, instead of stating the sentence, show the reality of "so don't expect to even understand your questions not to say answering them."" it will make you look much better and people wont be able to deny it.




"The reality we all experience is a direct product of our biology."

we dont experience reality, we experience our mind or inner experience"
reality is that which exists outside of us. oops epic fail!


"
The perceived reality is a 3D pseudo Euclidean with the Time being sensed only by the changes it causes to the physical system we observe.
The "real" reality we can only fumble through Mathematics is a non Euclidean 4D."

wow you sound so smart when you talk like that! only one problem.....

"The "real" reality"

what about the real "real" real reality?

 

Last edited: Apr 23, 2017

JIM STRATOS

DESTROY THIS BELOW point by point demonstrate your superiority fine sir.







"
the most important information related to this topic, that is the distinction between fiction and reality or to be more precise fiction vs non-fiction. I want to be very clear there is a such thing as fiction. In this specific situation I am referring to fiction being any thought ,concept, idea, proposition or statement which cannot demonstrably be shown to be true in the context of reality. In fact fiction is the vast majority of thoughts, ideas, concepts, propositions, and statements and the tiny minority are ones that can be demonstrably shown to be true in reality,

Why is this important at all in any way?

Because there is a way human beings actually work regarding our thought process and our minds. our thoughts are made of words and symbols which are virtual not real , so for any meaning to be there, we have to be talking about those symbols representing something and reality is what the words are supposed to represent. next we human beings are stuck in a subjective experience of spending each moment inside of our mind, we are capable of misunderstanding and not accounting for all details of a situation which leads to fictional or false propositions ideas and thoughts statements. Reality is outside of us. In order for us to utter words strung together in a meaningful way those words have to accurately be describing that outside reality. in order for that to take place we have to have demonstrable evidence , meaning we have to test and probe reality to see what the answer is to a question then we can formulate a thought about how things actually work or what exists in reality.

This means when it comes to the topic of how can a thought, idea, concept or proposition EVER be true. It can only be true IF we have demonstrable evidence or data from reality itself that we form a proposition or thought based on in order to talk about how things actually work or what exists outside of our experience which is subjective."

 

"JIM STRATOS

When you die you'll leave behind this biology and you'll "wake up" in a more real reality and your new "superior" biology will identify as a "dream" your current life due to the "lower" biology used to spark this dream in the first place. Just like the common dream that uses a smaller "part" of our biology to get started

The death here is the awakening elsewhere and you have to be prepared..."



psshahahahaha

yes sir your DEF on a different level! thanks so much for your " contribution;D"

all this time and the answer was right there!


"3D pseudo Euclidean" equals

"When you die you'll leave behind this biology and you'll "wake up" in a more real reality and your new "superior" biology will identify as a "dream" your current life due to the "lower" biology used to spark this dream in the first place. Just like the common dream that uses a smaller "part" of our biology to get started"




"
The death here is the awakening elsewhere and you have to be prepared."..
"
he SOLVED the morality problem , death = awakening elsewhere !

there is no such thing as murder ,killing, or death! it means teleportation! sweet!

and all those terrible things we said about Hitler when he just teleported those souls to a place they prepared wow!