That's why an ISRC and UPC are extremely important. With those codes you'll get paid royalties from radio spins. Domestic or not. That's why instead of joining a major label you should go independent, start your business and enjoy all the monetary perks labels do. SO many artist are doing it these days.

 

Is Record Union ok for this? Since you pay 25.00 do they still steal your cuts?

 

Dog! @subGENRE you write some the best music ive herd on this site man and altho my profile is not that old i been comin to this place and across the street to the AZ for it seems like bout 10 years >>> Push it brother Push it ! and wen some one tells you you cant do it or its to hard an to much standin in ur way>>> Fuckem >>>Push it even harder man @ REAL TALK \m/ You can copyright it or whatever but always remember just to keep ur projects safe >>> Backed up on drives online storage as many as possible digital time stamps are all the copyright you need trust me... But like @Von_Steyr originally said copyright is safest way an will yield alot less worry off you mind lol >>> Keep Rockin man \m/

 

thanks, i'm with PRS since a long time.

Labels : if you start independent how can you advertise your music with a low budget ? you will keep 100% of what ? maybe just a bunch of downloads and spotify plays.
I mean, If your music is so good at least one label will be willing to invest on you, let them risk their money $$ and later you will see what to do as the next step.

Your business ? there's no business without sales and you cant make sales without advertising and to market your product you need money $$$.
Yes, so many artists are doing it today because they already have a fanbase big enough to play gigs and publish some tracks but if you start from zero you're fucked, plain and simple, it will take forever to grab even just a few hundred followers and good luck monetizing such a small fanbase.

Gigs are the way to go, but you won't be booked for gigs unless you're on a good label or you've a big fanbase.

 

Copyrights are useful even when giving music away for free. They protect your rights, What if a cause or organization adopted your song as their theme song. Without a copyright, you can't stop unauthorized use.

 

I'm with PRS, radio was just an example, for instance you publish a freebie song for your fanbase only and this doesnt give anybody the right to air them on radio or tv or whatever, let alone using the track for free in a movie or in public .. it happens, because people think free means public domain, oh and somebody will even try to resell it .. good luck catching all the croocks around.

Sure you will get some pennies from your P.R.O. but that's not the point, you still never allowed any other use than the free playback on your own site or whatever .. but nobody will give a shit and then what you're gonna do ? sue people left and right across the globe ? same for bootlegs and for people recording your gigs and posting the video on youtube .. who the fuck gave the permission for that ?? and the uploader could even make some money if the video becomes viral, while you get nothing.

I see a total disrespect for authors rights and it's been like that since forever, actually it's getting a lot worse.
we're supposed to make pennies from P.R.O.s, pennies from downloads, pennies from youtube or whatever, and nothing from piracy and anything in between, and then screwed by labels and playing gigs for a pittance .. no wonder there's this widespread stereotype of the starving musician, everybody seems to be profiting one way or another from our music while we're supposed to invest years of our lives in learning an instrument and compose music for nothing ?

i remember the old diatribes about the initial boom of MP3s in the late 90s, with the crowd of spongers justifying it with music must be free and blah blah .. artists should make money with live gigs and blah blah .. well now that piracy and mp3 won the game the number of people actually paying for downloads is in freefall too as they're all switching to Streaming which pays even less for us, it's a paradise for music lovers but what's in store for us at the end of the day ? when the average DJ is making a lot more money than a good composer you realize the whole market is fucked up and i dont see a way out at the moment apart becoming a DJ myself, but it would be a total downgrade, i'll rather go back working as a clerk in a music store.

 

copyright is yours forever in any case, you dont need to claim anything as long as you're member of a P.R.O. and your tracks are under their wing.

labels wont mess with your copyright, they will mess with the number of sales, with the licence to play your music in this or that format or in this or that region, etc etc that's how they always screw you, there are 100 ways to screw you, even if you self publish you can get screwed by your distributor and they will because they can.

 

i think big labels wont even read your emails, but they will listen your music if somebody they trust is sponsoring you, for instance somebody from your label that wants to be distributed by a major label.

small and medium labels usually welcome demos and they have a demo submission page in their web site.
if they dont have a demo policy i would stay away.

but ask yourself why they welcome demos with open arms ? because they've little money to invest in promotion and a bucnh of mediocre musicians in their rooster.
so, it's OK to get the foot in the door but dont expect too much !

get the foot in the door and later make an upgrade somewhere else.

 

Nobody's born with a fanbase. You build it from scratch, yet you describe it as impossible lol. Everyone has to start from point zero. Each time you play at least acceptably in a live gig you 'll be earning new followers. Each time you put out a "good" track these fans, will listen to it and along with them their friends and so on, and no all this doesn't take forever. In fact nowadays things move quite faster than in the pre-internet era. The only downside is how to differentiate yourself from the myriads who are trying to do the same thing, but many posters have already given valuable and eligible answers, so i won't go into this again. Having a manager/agent is always better but in the worst case scenario you can do it yourself. Nobody started by playing Carnegie Hall and with a million records sold. We all have played in shitholes for 50-100 peeps and sold 50 copies of our first record when we thought it would be our lifetime achievement in the music biz lol. At least now, more or less and through places like this forum, upcoming artists can have a picture of what they will be facing stepping in the biz as pros. In my early days it was trial and error and the hard way too. A false move would mean 6 months in the "gutter" minimum, and boy have i made false moves lol.
So:
For those who deep inside know they deserve a "place in the sun" and are haunted for life by the everlasting "illness" of artistry, there is only way to go man. Forward.
And most likely they have nothing to lose by doing so. You only live once.
Cheers

 

All promotion and marketing is nowadays is spamming your material on social media, youtube and streaming sites like soundcloud. Ironically most major labels wont even sign anyone unless they've generated a buzz for themselves. Then once you're signed you get a fat advancement (depending on the label) then get legally robbed for your royalties, publishing and performance and show money. Labels aren't even useful for distribution deals if you think about it. Given that physical albums at this point in time are basically moot. Creating your own business and brand is the way to go.

 

and i fully agree, but creating your biz and brand includes first and foremost the marketing part so if you dont have a good budget you're back to square one.

solution : find a decent label first, and only when you're ready start your biz alone as a side project.
being "ready" = stable and loyal fanbase, some $$$ to risk and to invest.

p.s.
there's no reason to see Labels as the devil reincarnated, if you sign a bad contract blame yourself ! everything can be negotiated before signing.
your first label could easily screw you as you don't have much leverage and you're unknown and you're a newbie, but later on things will change, you will have YOUR fanbase and YOUR brand, and this gives you a lot more leverage power.

 

you can start from scratch of course but how long do you plan to stay in this limbo ? it can easily take years before you reach numbers big enough to make some decent money with your fanbase alone.

are you willing to focus 80% on marketing and just 20% on music ? because that's a realistic ratio.

if selling music is so hard why everybody here is against the idea of sharing/shifting the costs and risks with a third party (label) ?
are you aware that stock photo agencies keep from 50% to 80% of their sales ? do you think it's unreal ? yes but this happens because it's hard to sell stock images and stock videos, same as for music, if it was easy they would just keep 5-10% like in many other industries.

let's remind ourselves that it's hard to sell music even if it's priced just 0.99$ ... and the market still think it's overpriced as there's a massive migration to Spotify and other flat-fee streaming services.

all this proves is ... music is no more considered as a worthy product, less and less users are willing to pay even 0.99$ for a song.
they'll rather buy your 30$ t-shirt but dont ask them 0.99$ for a good song !
today you can definitely make more selling your merchandising and playing gigs than with downloads or streaming or CDs, music has become almost a marketing tool rather than the product itself.

this means all this hard work (producing music, spamming on socials, streaming, downloads, etc) is not paying the bills anymore, the cash $ will only come in playing gigs, and as you can be ripped off in 100 ways by signing for a label you can get ripped off a 1000 ways with agents and bookings, there's no escape from that and no way for you to have any kind of control in this scenario, you'll be always at the mercy of someone else unless you play on the street like a beggar and people put some money in your hand (business to business !).

besides, there's still life outside of gigs and streaming !
a good chunk of my music is made and sold for stock music libraries and i'm very happy with that, no need for labels, for agents, and for additional middlemen.
if they asked me where to start i would say start with Stock, but it's a totally different ballgame, you need quantity and quality and what sells as stock rarely sells in other markets.

there are many markets, and studio musicians are still not dead.

 

The question at hand is not how long it will take, the answer to this is irrelevant, different ppl=different skill&mindset, different circumstances, etc etc. So it is futile to try and pinpoint this, for others it may well take an eternity and for some two-three years perhaps.
The original question is whether the op should go for it and as you can see, even with all the different opinions here, all agree the op is talented enough to go for it. Being a musician and being an artist is two different beasts. The former requires training, practice, some tools of the trade etc. The latter requires nothing but talent and possibly aesthetics. It is why being a musician can be a profession and being an artist is more or less a "shot at the impossible". And it is the obstacle if you like, those whose may want to call themselves artists, are bound to overcome: Their own limit.
Cheers

 

@subGENRE, am I the first person to ask about the Thailand connection here? Mickey-Thai. What's the Thai connection? You state your locaton on SC as the States but would it be easier perhaps for you to get some attention in Thailand? Indeed, are you not telling us that you are already a big star in Bangkok? . Well, anyone looking to invest in you would want to know why they would be pushing a name that's all about Thailand, so what's the story?

Getting back to the advice. One thing that's coming through loud and clear from reading all the advice is the old adage, 'It's who you know' and it still seems to hold true. In my part of the business [radio and Press] I got in by just approaching DJs, radio stations, magazines, knocking on doors, giving club DJs my bedroom and pirate radio demos, asking to do a little set for a little while when it was quiet in the club, asking to do an overnight radio show for no pay, and so on. When you really want it you'll do anything to get yourself in front of people who can help. You need to make friends. Start at the smallest, easiest clubs, bars, offer to help the DJ. That DJ will know other DJs or maybe even an agent and the rest is .. the future. Make friends who can help you. Don't waste your time trying to get a label deal at this stage. Work your way in slowly, meet people, ask for advice from within.

Also, has anyone ever thought of asking the loop sample pack makers for advice? Maybe they have connections with record companies. Surely they are at least giving away some of their stuff to DJs, labels and studios to test out their stuff.

 

Copyright is an issue allways. lots of so called big names steal . Just make sure you uploaded your songs to a web site (i.e. youtube) make it private.
So you can allways proove you had that great musical number 1 hit idea before someone else . And then go out and show your music everybody you can !!!!

 

Yes, of course the OP should go for it, actually he should try anyway just for the experience.
Talent : talent is one thing, but it's not a predictor for his ability to produce several good songs in the future, it's totally up to him, maybe he can make one hit per year or maybe he can do 1-2 good track per week, in any case i still think he should better focus on what he's good for (producing music) and outsourcing the marketing to a Label, at least at the beginning and as long as he doesn't feel comfortable doing it all alone.

Limitations, yes, exactly ! we're all different and for sure some musicians are very good at business too but in general it tends to be a zero-sum game so the time taken by marketing is time taken away from production and one way or another you'll have to deal with it .. how much time a beginner musician can dedicate to his hobby ? if he's working 9-5 for instance when and how he;s going to find the time to produce AND to market And to ... ?

That's why a label will always come handy, it saves time and time=money, if you get screwed you'll learn a good lesson for the next time but in the meantime your tracks are published, distributed, and marketed while you're at work or at home producing your next tracks.

I'm not saying a label will save you any money ! of course it's a scam but a label will get the job done and that's the key factor if you start from scratch.
People here talk about DJs and friends of a friend, yes that's OK and that's how it works in general but what if you dont want to befriend lousy DJs and you dont want to spend hours and hours with phone and email and going to events etc ? is this the death of studio musicians ? no, not yet, actually studio musicians are doing fine as long as they've distribution and licensing deals.

there's nothing wrong giving 50% of a sale to stock agency or a distributor or whoever else doing deals for you, even when you sell on amazon or itunes or spotify you're giivng them a fee, so what's the difference ? nobody can sell and make 100% nowadays, even if you print your own CDs and sell them at your gigs there's always someone else grabbing a small fee.

let them work for you in exchange for a fair price and focus on what you do best : producing music.

 

You don't need a budget to market yourself nowadays. All you need is wifi, and a facebook, twitter, youtube and soundcloud account. That's literally all you need.

 

I listened to your stuff, here are some thoughts. It really helps if you're a performing artist with a fan base and street cred. If you're flipping remixes with sampled artists' work you can use your current track list to try and pitch yourself to record labels as someone who can remix their artist catalogue. Just cold calling labels is tough, its about showing a market for your work, and giving your tracks away free doesn't really build value to your brand. I hate to say but simply writing good music is just the beginning of a tough path but if you want it bad enough you can get there. Sweep the leg!

 

i agree with this completely back in the 90's and early 2000's i was in a band with the original bass player from Jackyl >>>Thomas Bettini who had quit the band to form his own... Also he's a good friend of mine He lives in Kingsport Tn. where we grew up... We played alot of shows alover the US own our own... cause without the numbers its hard to get any kind of Deal an just to be Honest the record Deals of today are far from anything of the past cause budget just isnt there anymore But dont ever let that stop you \m/ Back in the old days you could just have a shit load of records printed ,an either sell them or throw em off a bridge lol >>> cause as long as you had the numbers to show the Record Company it was easier to get a showcase for an A&R scout an maybe a Deal... we did this But it wasnt anything we wanted to sign onto so we turned it down... I mean hey a record Deal is just a loan... thats it i mean they offerd us 500,000 for an Album>>> but out of that 500,000 thousand you had to pay for the production of your album Recording, Mixing,Mastering,pressing/printing of the Disc for sale, all your merchandise to sale at your shows. you had to pay for Rent or Buy a tour bus and the road crew to go with you>>> SO>>> at the end of the day you are now broke as hell and depending on how well the Label pushes your band will determine if you even get good Gigs to play... They own you period and untill they get their 500,000 back you only get the money you make of your live shows and Merchandise sales lol .... so in short you get a real hard fuckin if your band Flops cause the label will drop ur ass and you will still owe them your life on payback and they will collect all the money from your record sales till that debt is payed in full>>> then you might get pennies from the album sales ;) I know all this was the way it was in the Late 90's an 2000's wen i was Giggin with my past bands and Really nothin has changed sept most of it is Digital sales... Its best to do things for urself Build up that fan base Get loads of views on Youtube, soundcloud, iTunes and just keep pushin and pushin \m/ Its alot better to fly solo than end up bankrupt and some label owning all your hard work \m/

 

I guess there already enough technical points raised in that aspect.
Some more important than others but that's always the way
All I can say is that I've heard your music and why the hell not?? Go for it, jump in & give it your all.
Put any negativity as there always lots of it and stuff that way in a big box, bury it & go for it.
If you stumble, get back up & go again. Day after day, night after night & all that
Who knows with a load of hard work & passion could very well get a real cool result & could be your stuff that getting a million hits etc.
Whatever any one says, never give up if that is your goal
For me personally, anything outside purely technical aspects wrt music requires the artist to develop an identity and use that character to engage and develop a loyal fanbase. Always respect your fans and listeners and treat them as family.
Go for the pyramid type of growth and keep it genuine and real.
Good for you as it takes courage but of course with a load of work the gratification, satisfaction & returns can be huge.
Nice one indeed & hopefully look forward to hearing your first big song somewhere soon