I dont know what you have seen there, but it certainly wasnt Starter 64bit.

Such an edition does not exist.

If you care to inform yourself you can do that here (see comparison chart at bottom) or even directly at Microsoft (see under Performance).

 

Has what I said just been skipped over just cause it's hard to argue against?

dan just went into how to set a mainboard BIOS to use memory bus exstentions. helpful if you mainboard has the feature but I've not seen many with it.

Captain_Future I know what you meen but I've seen stripped down versions made for small laptops. Normally you can't buy them, their made for a set type of machine and come with that machine. I can only assume thats what dan's seen, I may be wrong but only he know's what he's seen.

Still can someone who's for 32bit systems exsplain how its 32bit processing is better then the 64bit processing? or are we ignoreing that fact and me?

Memory is not the only change is the systems. word size for processors change.

 

Well this is a good topic, regardless of what my opinions are or others.

It is important for us to not be subjected to imposed restrictions, due to the fact that we then start to accept them.

I have never accepted any limitations, imposed or factual.

Is it better to run a 32 bit app in a 32 bit OS or 64?

Well the answer is very simple, the 32 bit app will have a big advantage in a 32 bit OS vs running it in a 64 bit OS

If you read my posts you would of seen that I dual boot: windows xp 32 bit and windows 7 ultimate ( 64 bit)

For me on the windows 7 64 bit everything is 64 bit NO 32 bit apps/ plugins what so ever.
If you run a 32 bit app in windows 7 64 bit look at the task manager and you will see the windows 7 "wow" interpreter for 32 bit apps running, there is a bit tax lost on the interpreter.

So I run both, one boot for video editing (64 bit), and the other boot has windows xp 32 bit for all my audio work ( more compatibility with older hardware too)


One of the most critical things to speed up any windows OS is to simply get rid of the shell. for the last few years I have been running BBLEAN as my shell. It runs about 4 megs of ram that is it. Check out EXPLORER.EXE and see how much it runs on any taskmanager. This explorer shell is the biggest problem with windows and no one ever talks about it, and for me it is one the easiest speed tips to do get rid of it, install BBLEAN, and you will have multiple desktops and a proper shell.


Don't believe all the Microsoft BS .

It's a big fact that Microsoft does not want you to turn a desktop into a Server, this is why they restrict the Desktop editions with these weird limits.

It's simple, limits =control= money= suckers rolling in .

 

well in regards to an ssd i can buy a 60gig one for about $120 here in Aus and it should approx last to 2021 according to ssd-life which is accurate readings. so i ain't wastin anything. u be smart install what you need and stream your project audio from this ssd but don't have too many projects going at once and you will get full advantage. i never mentioned using it for storage and i don't still have 30gb free of course i don't have many plugs installed at the moment which don't bother me.

so try a 60-80gig ssd one day you will love it.

 

I'm sorry but everything that comes out of dan's mouth is so clouded by technological fetishism that it's bordering on pointless . . I'm not saying he's wrong on everything he says but his approach to a freaking DAW-centric computer is so convoluted that it borders on ridiculousness.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but I seriously worry for anyone who takes dan's 'advice' seriously . . patching kernels, replacing shells, BB-fucking-LEAN! Geez man, when are you going to put up a Litestep tutorial FFS . . this is supposed to be an audio forum and you're encouraging people to waste hours and days and weeks patching kernels and dicking around with alternative shells for no practical or justifiable reason when they should be making music . .

Option A: Follow dan's 'advice', build an x86 OS based system, patch your OS kernel, replace explorer with BBLEAN and look forward to hours and hours of reading forums, fucking with config files and trying to get your system to work . . .

Option B: Buy an x64 OS based system and be up-and-running instantly and making music with your new tool . .

The unfortunate thing with people that buy into Option A is that they waste so much time on technological fetishism that they then feel compelled to justify their misguided decision and they start trying to convince others to buy in to the same convoluted approach . .

BBLEAN uses 4MB of RAM on dan's system . . MS explorer uses about 35MB on my x64 systems . . in context: no fucking practical difference at all! RAM is not a performance bottleneck on an x64 system. Not even worth the time really . . this is why no-one has ever walked in to a professional recording environment and seen BBLEAN or any alternative shell for that matter . . a professional recording environment should minimise distractions from the outside world; distractions to the artist and definitely distractions to the recording engineer/producer what have you . . following dan's advice would be completely ignoring that basic principal . .

Do what you want though of course . . this is my second and definitely my last rant on this topic

 

Well there is a point to your post it is not for "power on and everything go" users.
Bblean shell takes 5 seconds to install. Another 5 seconds to uninstall.
Patching the kernel takes 1 minute to install, ( 10 seconds to patch and 15 seconds to boot back up to the desktop)

all in all less than 2 minutes to have a super tight system

The only thing that indeed takes a long time to do is shutting down your services, but this is microsoft's fault not ours

I dare anyone to match my running services

this is with no apps running and still have network connections

Windows XP - 5 services
Windows 7 - 14 services


Okay lets see your #'s

Here is another reason why I still like XP and okay I am giving away some secrets but
"HARDWARE PROFILES" what moron would get rid of them from windows 7!!!!!!

Windows Vista and Windows 7 do not have hardware profiles
In windows XP you can for example: goto hardware manager, disable the hardware you do not need aka printers and scanners and cameras, then save that profile. Now on your windows XP boot menu you can choose what profile to use.

There, yet another thing that could allow to use your OS as "Audio only stuff" killed from windows 7

Again hammer on the head I only use windows 7 for video editing. No audio due to these missing features in windows 7, you can not make a custom system exclusive for audio.

I am learning all this from my computer tech. He has a small computer store, now I know why everyone brings in their Daw's there, as they never ever rarely bring them in for service.

Thank god I found this guy lol.

The first day I brought my laptop and desktop there he said this to my face "If you want to keep working the same lame way and have always problems then there is the door behind you. If you want to work different get a mac, if you want to work different have all the control you need then leave your machines here and when you come back, get ready to learn a new shell and proper ways of doing things"

OKay I did not like that guy, I left. But one week I came back and a few days later with my machines done ( a lot done to both of them. stuff that I though why would you change that? He said the door remember!!! I have not gone back in 3 years for issues, in fact I asked this guy to come along with me on my shows.


For my live mixing I asked him to separate my laptop screen since I bought a cabinet with a nice top on it
I love this setup with the laptop, since I am mostly standing up on the stage in the back.

This pc tech is not just pc's, he custom makes pedal boards, usb control pads for the audio guys around these parts. He also does custom mods to you gear, guitar fx units and weird stuff like that.
This guys is expensive but you get what you want, you are not locked into the shoehorn that you buy stock.

 

2 things you said I got to comment on

We'll start with profiles
They where removed cause no one uses them. It's a feature that was for people who use unstable drivers when useing hard wear for a set task, normally exsotic things like magnetic tape drives / zip drive / ect and out dated devices that had no support in windows.

If you used one of these unstable devices you'd set 2 profiles main and backing up.
Main has the unstable device disabled
Back up has the unstable device enabled

you'd use the 2nd profile to use the tape or zip drive to back up


I use to know a few epople who set profiles to optimise for video and music editing but none of them cared when the feature was removed as they'd given up on useing it by windows 7 came out.

I don't know anyone who uses vista. A opperating system has to exsist for at least a year before you move to it cause till then there's not programs that are 100% compatible.


**side note- You can still disable hardwear on windows 7. They removed profiles from windows 7 not device manager. I have a video capture card disabled at the moment.


This man you've talked about
Your words you've quoted of his, are describeing useing a custom opperating system.
Work same lame, use windows. work differant, use mac. or work smart leave it with me, install his own version.

Remeber what microsoft use to say "Just cause it looks like windows dosen't meen its windows"
They where talking about genuin versions as in not cracked but it applies in this case to.
It may have windows parts, but it's not windows. I'ts illegal to reverse engeneer windows and copy parts, this dosn't stop it happening.

I've met plenty of people who build and use custom opperating systems, most use a form of linux coupled with windows 98 (as millenium and 200 where desasters) lately they've incorperated XP features and looks.
I've not heard personally of anyone going as far as win 7 but its not impossible.

When a custom system uses the full windows interface you never know the differance till it comes to drivers.



If your useing custom opperating system you shouldn't really be useing it as a comparison for windows 7 against XP. As what you have is neather windows 7 or XP but 64bit and 32bit opperating systems that are useing window's interfaces

 

Well seeing from your point of view then yes my xp and windows 7 are "custom" since neither have the windows explorer shell, and both are heavily optimized for live work and both have their kernel patched for forced PAE.

It took a few weeks to get used to bblean, but what it has is multiple desktops a/b/c, tabbed shells so I can have control panel floating on the desktop on let's say desktop C, while desktop A has MIDIOX running, on desktop B I have Reaper running. I need it this way for live mixing, it's total control and Bblean shell runs only 4 megs of ram.

It took a while but after I thought how am I ever going back to the lame explorer shell

Instead of talking about it try it it's open source, for linux, mac and windows
It changed the way I work with my computers even though I hated it at first.

Remember I make music but I don't want to be a fool either, and be the type that has no clue what is going on behind what I paid for.

Right now I am making a mixer for Reaper in Pure Data using OSC.

http://puredata.info/

Realtime audio environment so you can make your custom mixers and other stuff then the panels you make connect to Reaper (OSC support)

This is what I been waiting for a long time for audio.

Try it out and see..

 

nah i'm with dan here get the best out of 32 bit, face it plugins and all that do work better on a 32 bit os and xp is still great, only reason i have win7 is cause i have one of them 3tb hdd and it's not detected in win xp.

 

Hi, I am not using any 3 terabyte drives yet however this info is for you if you are on XP

Windows xp can work with your 3 tb drive, however since they are using GPT partitions, again yet another "microsoft limitation" to force you unto another OS
.

Paragon has a driver ( a signed driver to install, very quick). Then you can partition all your 3 TB drive
(you can pick up the app on your local torrent site...)
There is a catch, the 3 TB drive can not be used as the main OS drive, but can be used as a secondary, install or data stuff ( can't boot an OS I mean)

h**p://www.paragon-software.com/technologies/components/gpt-loader/

 

I haven't hit the need for a hard drive that size yet.
but just out of interest what stops you useing disc management to partition the hard drive?

Any one else remeber it? tool still around from windows 95?
its in

Control Panel (All Control Panel Items)
Administrative Tools
Computer management.msc
Disc management tab

Last I try'd it partition'd drives that are to big to use. Then again that was in 2001 when I was on windows 98. (20Gb too big my bum)
Some tools get for gotten about. Still I may be wrong, the new version might not be able.

Then again it's not really a 3Tb drive when its working like 2 1.5Tb drives


and dan I was on about more then just the shell. XP onwards is float based systems, Vista was microsofts first dule float system.
Line based have always been faster and more stable, unless you mess with there files wile running the thing.
Are you sure its modded windows and not modded Linuix to work like windows? There's alot of smart people and nothings real when it comes to whats on a screen.

 

Yes the issue with Windows has always and will always be the very crappy coded shell. Non shell should ever take up 30+ megs of ram to run and I noticed on dozens of machines ( other's machines) that their explorer.exe is pushing sometimes 40 megs with no apps running.

My computer's are running XP and windows 7, no linux stuff The pc tech left 2 batch files ( thats what they look like) on the desktop, one says extreme that means even the network services get killed . The other batch is to run network all else is nuked. ( I don't need anything else, only audio services of course duh!!)
He is also modding my POD HD 500, changing the stomp switches for more stronger ones and some other requested changes ( extra inputs on the back some other stuff changed as well like the LED's ). So hes going to be taken it apart and doing the changes this weekend

We have become very close friends. I let him use some of my gear, in exchange for services.

I did not know jack about computers until I met him, and I have been using computers since the dos days. I just never needed to know the internals.

From my PC Tech:
Windows xp "on purpose limited" can only see 2 terabyte drives, but with the Paragon GPT driver you can access 3 terabytes and up in windows xp ( SP2 is minimal you need)

Again these are imposed limits on purpose or sometimes just lack of thought on the developers.

I confirmed with another audio buddy of mine and he is indeed using it on his Audio FX network Server ( Reaper FX LAN)

Maybe I am going to steal his gear LOL

 

Can I just wrap this up with this statement


There's no problems with 64bit opperating. However 64bit opperating systems require extra resorces when dealing with 32bit applications. This is due to the need to convert the codeing language from 32bit to 64bit for the processor.


Anyone got a problem with that statement?


I think that covers everyone.

dan01's finding of Cubase 32bit runs better on 32bit then his 64bit

Everyone else's finding that they upgraded and from resorce shortage to ample resorces and didn't see the improvement they where exspecting as they also added a 64bit processor and use it for 32bit applications

and dan You've got something no one else has. It's modded beyond what everyone here can do, with the exseption of crackers and plugin makers. A argument post is not the place for your few tips.

Start a Topic with the title of improveing 32bit windows XP if your wanting them tips to be of help cause no one will think of looking for them here.
Pluse its a lot to read to find a couple of tips

 

Actually was going to do that, might as well put all the tips in one place...


So now comes 128 bit? I don't think so

64 bit will the last CMOS type architecture, my money is on ARM ( UK based)

The issue is always software... and has been since the DOS day's, As apple really never solved that one to make them the top of computer users. In fact Apple with their "copied" GUI from Xerox Parc still did no dominate the computer industry even till today.

In the end it comes down to what apple has figured out, there is nothing left to do in computers and no profit left, hence they are moving away from computers ( phasing out soon the Mac Pro's) as I suspected, ditching Logic to the mass users and even tried to get "Pro" video editors to ditch Final Cut by taking off the "PRO" features from Final Cut X ( eventually so many editors complained that most left to Avid, then apple was forced to put those features back when all the complaints started)