Hello everyone,

I was looking around the internet for a new audio interface, I'm looking to upgrade in the near future.

I noticed that the latest thing is "Thunderbolt 2" audio interfaces, which allow for much lower latencies. I found out that I could buy a little PCIe card on my motherboard to have a thunderbolt 2 port, so I was pretty excited...

... but all the audio interfaces out there with thunderbolt 2 are MAC ONLY (Zoom TAC-2, UAD), even though plenty of PC's are now equipped with it.

Does anyone know of an audio interface using thunderbolt 2 compatible with windows ?

 

I think some Focusrite interfaces are Thunderbolt equipped.

Here: http://us.focusrite.com/firewirethunderbolt-audio-interfaces

Edit: I've just read through it... they are Thunderbolt compatible but you need an adapter.

 

Thunderbolt Apple/Intel is an almost useless format for audio.
Like Firewire was.

I remember Mac Pro users adding a Firewire card with Texas Instrument chip, because factory integrated chip was pure crap, creating more troubles than USB.

You are on Win ? Forget about Firewire and even more Thunderbolt.
That's my advice as computer tech for 20 years and electronic musician for 15 years
And forget even more about firewire to thunderbolt adapters : they will introduce latency, rendering the whole "upgrade" useless.

Thunderbolt (or Firewire) creating less latency (by essence) than USB (being 2.0 or 3.0, latency is the same) is a myth.
Even a good old USB 2.0 interface can handle 8 ins/outs around 2-3ms at 96kHz, with enough bandwidth to run all INS and OUTS.

I call that Apple commercial bullsh*t. That's why Firewire was a "side" format. Theorical bandwidth and latency is nothing when you plug a Firewire audiocard on your Mac Pro and it doesn't work because you need an additionnal Texas Instrument PCI card.
Reality check hurts

This is reality check :
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/music-computers/618474-audio-interface-low-latency-performance-data-base.html

The first one, under 2ms, is USB. And RME Fireface, USB or FW, get exactly the same latency.

Sorry to rain on your parade, but to me, you are loosing your time and your money with TB on Win

 

Thanks for the insight !

I was actually wondering about how effective the extra bandwidth was since an audio interface doesn't really use that much anyways.

Based on what I read it seems like thunderbolt 2 interfaces do give a little boost in terms of latency but it seems like they're not making any for windows. And thunderbolt 1 interfaces provide the same bandwidth as USB 3.0 so you're right, why bother.

I might go with an RME babyface after all since I don't need many I/O. I just need a solid audio interface giving me minimal latency and good sound at 96khz. RME seem to make the best out of USB bandwidth

 

You can't go wrong with this one. Although, buying the fireface uc could be a worthy investment - you never know what you might need in the future and the fireface gives you more options.

 

think at one pci express 3 interface and forget TB for now ...it will be long till it gets standardized ...if !

 

PCI is where there is really less latency for sure, and more stability

But the price will rise more than expected. And you will be limited to a desktop computer only.
Whereas you can move a non-rack USB interface with a laptop (to record a band at home...).

As far as "standard" goes, PCI is used in studio with a lot of ins/outs. It is stable, and desktop computer based.
And USB will not die anytime soon. It was already supposed to be dead 10 years ago...and now we get 3.0

So, PCI seems over sized.
But a Fireface instead of Baby seems a good option. Especially when FF prices are going a little down

 

Audio Interfaces don't need to be any faster than USB2 transfer rates.

Even if you record 8 channels of 192khz 32 bits you won't cap out USB2's typical transfer rate of 30MB/s (Theoretically 60MB/s)

192khz x 32 bits x 1 byte/8 bit x 8 channels = 6.1 MB/Second


The only thing audio related thunderbolt makes sense for is DSP like UAD stuff since you could be sending and receiving dozens of tracks worth of audio.

UAD needs to make an Ethernet version, that way you could connect them to a router and create a DSP farm (more like an ant farm) and have multiple computers connect to it at any given time.

 

Huge chunk of the quality of an audio interface is in the quality of the audio driver. Not the interface standard. Not even features and AD/DA converters. RME is capable of making any interface standard work great, but it's always preferable to use PCIe or PCI cards if you need to work at very low latencies with many plugins. When you check the list at Gearslutz you can say that this is the list of companies who make great/bad drivers. It totally coincides with my experiences with different cards. So buying a "fing-chu" firewire audio interface is not the same thing as buying RME Fireface 800, far from it. Regarding Focusrite FW interfaces they work better these days and I recommend them wholeheartedly lately, as well as TC audio interfaces. This list is quite old and some manufacturers have managed to bring their drivers up to par with others in the meantime. Focusrite and TC specifically.

Buying an audio interface is actually pretty straight forward: if you don't want any problems whatsoever and want to churn out music as soon as possible, buy anything from RME or Lynx. This recommendation is based on facts and experience, not pretentiousness or something. ;) If you want good value for the money and a bit less spectacular ASIO driver performance with having to possibly tinker with it for a bit buy TC Electronic, Focusrite, or M-Audio. I give advantage to TC and Focurite here because of the solid hardware quality. But certainly forget about "fing-chu" and leave it for others to fiddle and tinker with it. [fing-chu could be all these USB interfaces from AKAI, Roland, Edirol...] Now don't get me wrong - some people will be perfectly fine with these cheap USB interfaces, but it's a greater risk and they certainly don't deliver the level of performance like the top tier cards. You get what you pay for. ;)

Personally I use RME HDSP 9652 PCI in my main computer, and I use TC Electronic Konnekt 48 [FireWire] as my recording [A>D] interface. No problems of any kind with either of them. I didn't choose TC Konnekt 48 because it's firewire, but because of its great sound and great features. Thankfully the TC ASIO driver isn't too shabby nowadays as it used to be. I'm actually planning on buying another one for additional I/O. That's how good it is, and it costs only around 500 euro in Europe. Older RME HDSP PCI[e] cards can also be found for a good price nowadays, around 300 euro and they're worth every cent of it.

So yes, I think your decision to go with RME Babyface is a very good decision! But keep in mind what fraifikmushi said: "you never know what you might need in the future and the fireface gives you more options." Babyface is rather restricted.

Cheers!

 

Yeah, drivers are in the same vein than that famous "bad" Firewire chip on some Macs.
If your card doesn't work, crackle, shutdown...there is no point at all.

Even a working 16bits soundcard is better than an half working 24bits

About the continuous converters race, remember Thriller was recorded with the first crappy digital converters
Preamps, mic,acoustic...talent is more important.
And a working soundcard

 

I've been running all kinds of interfaces for more than 2 decades and I can't say that PCI really improves latency.
RME is a good example of this. Excellent latencies on both Firewire/USB.

Carstens of RME also stated that Thunderbolt is overrated for Audio and that USB/1394 is adequate.

USB supposed to be dead 10 years ago? Firewire is bad for audio? Dude, you really need to chill and get your facts straight.